Sis and Halo

This is where to talk about Pit Bulls!

Postby Chris Fraize » July 25th, 2006, 12:36 am

It's been brought to my attention that some folks directly or indirectly have been giving Sis a bit of grief or second guessing her decision to return Halo to his previous owners. While I understand commitment and responsiblity for the lifetime of the dog I feel that there is some information that these folks are lacking.

Sis took ownership of Halo on my recommendation because he was to be her first working dog. Halo was evaluated and was found to be a good match for Sis. As we began to work the dog, chronic back injuries away from the training field limited Halo’s progress and desire to continue working. After many long hours of consideration I recommended that Sis try and place Halo in a pet home or return him to his previous owners where he wouldn’t be subjected to the physical demands that bite work, high level obedience agility etc…would have on him. In the beginning Sis was reluctant to heed my advice due to her love and commitment for Halo. However, she has now spent much more time around high-level working dogs and has a deeper understanding of the physical demands that this kind of work takes on a dog.

It may sound to some of the non working folks out there that some of the sports we participate in may take a toll on a dog and make no mistake this is true but most dogs were bred to work and LOVE having a job. Knowing this, a dog with chronic injuries isn’t going make it as a working dog and it’s not fair to ask him to try.

With this new found understanding and my professional opinion to place Halo, Sis’ made the very emotional but well thought out decision to place Halo in a pet home Or return him to his previous owners. To some on the outside looking in on Sis’ decision it can be very easy to point fingers and make negative comments regarding the fate of Halo. I have assured Sis that these comments are coming from over emotional and uniformed individuals who are not privy to any of the professional suggestions on my part and the open-minded acceptance on Sis’ part. I applaud Sis for making the tough but responsible decisions that she has made regarding Halo. Working dogs are a far cry from your everyday average house pet.
The change has not always been easy for Sis. However, her intelligence, compassion and open-mindedness have seen her through this crisis and these same three traits are the reason we are proud to have her as a member of the Maine Association of Dogsports.

Safe training,
Chris Fraize
Chris Fraize
Snot Nose Bully Pup
 
Posts: 178
Location: Acton, Maine

Postby Purple » July 25th, 2006, 6:54 am

No issues here, sis, rock on.
User avatar
Purple
I live here
 
Posts: 5115

Postby babyreba » July 25th, 2006, 10:00 am

It's nice that you are showing support for your friend, Chris . . . but to be honest, don't these kinds of posts usually create more drama rather than less? I mean, most of us on the board probably wouldn't have even known she'd returned Halo if this post had never been made . . . I know I certainly had no clue till I read this . . .
User avatar
babyreba
Supremely Bully
 
Posts: 1132

Postby Romanwild » July 25th, 2006, 10:05 am

I have assured Sis that these comments are coming from over emotional and uniformed individuals who are not privy to any of the professional suggestions on my part and the open-minded acceptance on Sis’ part.


I like to say that I have no problem with what she is doing. But I would like to reply to your post anyway.

First thing is that obviously the people that have a problem with what sis is doing aren't the only over emotional ones since you find the need to post about it.

Secondly, since they are uniformed then why don't you post more of your professional suggestions in the training section?

This is a message board and debate and different opinions are what make them what they are. A good thread can sometimes do more to educate then reading a book. A good arguement/dis-agreement can make us truly think and come up with better solutions which, ultimately, on this board, can help the dogs. At least I hope so.

If someone doesn't want to be scrutinized then they shouldn't post their business on a public forum.

More on the topic, I believe it was Bahamutt that wrote a blog recently that talks about the dissention between the pet bull owners and the working dog people. This is a good example of that right here.

Part of our goal with this forum was to try and unite these two parties and maybe bring about some mutual understanding in order to help save the breed and for all of us to better understand each other and the dogs.
User avatar
Romanwild
I live here
 
Posts: 2931
Location: Watertown NY

Postby a-bull » July 25th, 2006, 10:07 am

I didn't see anyone questioning her on here, but if she is receiving pm's, I'd just ignore them. Nobody is under any obligation to respond to anyone on a forum.

People get dragged through the wringer for decisions or opinions they post on forums all the time---sort of the nature of them I guess.

I think the best thing to do in situations like this is to not share personal info. if you're uncomfortable being judged, because again, that can be the nature of forums---or if you want to share personal information, then you have to be willing to shrug off whatever comes your way.

In my opinion, having someone else post an explantion/justification for you just attracts more interest and questions. Honestly, until this thread, I thought she had decided to keep him because she still talks about him in her posts.

It's sort of the equivalent of someone disagreeing with me, and me bringing a professional on here to back me up. In the end, that would attract more attention than what I perceived to be the original issue.
DISCLAIMER:

My posts are my own opinions unless otherwise stated. They are not necessarily correct for all dogs or all owners.
a-bull
I live here
 
Posts: 2926

Postby a-bull » July 25th, 2006, 10:09 am

Romanwild wrote:
I have assured Sis that these comments are coming from over emotional and uniformed individuals who are not privy to any of the professional suggestions on my part and the open-minded acceptance on Sis’ part.


I like to say that I have no problem with what she is doing. But I would like to reply to your post anyway.

First thing is that obviously the people that have a problem with what sis is doing aren't the only over emotional ones since you find the need to post about it.

Secondly, since they are uniformed then why don't you post more of your professional suggestions in the training section?

This is a message board and debate and different opinions are what make them what they are. A good thread can sometimes do more to educate then reading a book. A good arguement/dis-agreement can make us truly think and come up with better solutions which, ultimately, on this board, can help the dogs. At least I hope so.

If someone doesn't want to be scrutinized then they shouldn't post their business on a public forum.

More on the topic, I believe it was Bahamutt that wrote a blog recently that talks about the dissention between the pet bull owners and the working dog people. This is a good example of that right here.

Part of our goal with this forum was to try and unite these two parties and maybe bring about some mutual understanding in order to help save the breed and for all of us to better understand each other and the dogs.


:goodthoughts:
DISCLAIMER:

My posts are my own opinions unless otherwise stated. They are not necessarily correct for all dogs or all owners.
a-bull
I live here
 
Posts: 2926

Postby Sue » July 25th, 2006, 10:30 am

Gee, I guess anyone with differing opinions is over emotional and uninformed. But I suppose since I dont' have a "working" dog, I just don't get it. Whatever.

Like a-bull said, don't want a reaction? Don't post it.
Sue
Bull Meister
 
Posts: 1389

Postby cheekymunkee » July 25th, 2006, 10:41 am

Most of the people on this board ARE pet owners. If we seem "over emotional" and "uniformed" it is because we care about the dogs we meet on these boards. Quite a few of the people on this board I have known for years. I've never seen 99% of them in person & probably never will, most I have not even seen a picture of, but I would recognize their dogs anywhere. If that makes us over emotional, so be it. This may sound mean but it is not meant to be, it is honesty: I care more about people's dogs than I do them.
There's a fine line between genius and insanity. I have erased this line.

Debby
User avatar
cheekymunkee
I Have Your Grass
 
Posts: 28540
Location: Dallas

Postby SisMorphine » July 25th, 2006, 11:19 am

I don't think that people being nasty to Chris about this is necessary. I was upset lastnight that people were making comments to me about it, and he was upset that I was upset so he posted.

And as far as keeping personal stuff off the boards I do. Any bouts of illness and such I pretty much keep off of the board. It's not necessary. But I hadn't mentioned Halo in a while and I had people inquire. How would it look if all of a sudden, poof, he disappeared with no explanation? Bad. And I'm not going to lie about it because that's not my style. Currently he is still here. He's still getting loved, getting attention, and getting as much exercise as he can handle, and continuing to lose weight, I think he's lost about 10 pounds since I got him, which is good since he was a fatty (and continuing to gather bones and stash them under the coffee table in the livingroom). He was going to be an awesome working dog, but his injuries (which stemmed from things that happened to him prior to me taking him on, which I was not made aware of until much much later as the old owners didn't think it would affect his work) have forced him into early retirement.

When I took him on I signed a contract with the old owners that stated they wanted first right of refusal if I ever had to give him up. Verbally they told me that as soon as he was retired they wanted him back (they were both sick, though both in remission now, and felt bad that they couldn't work him the way he needed to be worked, so they wanted him back once his work-duties were fulfilled). They appeared to be very sincere about this, so I took him on fully believing that it was a temporary (4-5 year) deal. Stupid me, I did not get that part in writing, and it's been a very emotional 6+ weeks trying to get in touch with them and figure out the best solution for Halo. Chris, April, Megan, and MAD have been a great support system for me, helping me make informed, yet difficult, decisions regarding this.

I didn't get a dog and then move to a place where my landlord doesn't allow dogs. I didn't get a dog, then get a second dog and decide I don't want the first one. I didn't get a dog and then "develop allergies" and return it. I didn't get a dog and then decide caring for it was too much.

I got a dog on a temporary basis to work. The "temporary" ended up being far more temporary than was first believed, and the people who had promised to take him back before, are now pussy-footing around me and not giving me an answer one way or the other. In the mean time a dog is here, going a little stir crazy due to the super busy environment and not being able to work.

I didn't want to sit and make justifications, but felt greatly that I needed to.
"All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another." -Anatole France
SisMorphine
They're like service dogs gone wrong.
 
Posts: 9233
Location: PR

Postby Romanwild » July 25th, 2006, 11:29 am

I don't think that people being nasty to Chris about this is necessary. I was upset lastnight that people were making comments to me about it, and he was upset that I was upset so he posted.


Nasty? I have to disagree with you there but that's o.k.

I'm glad you got to say what you wanted to. I'm sure it was a tough decision for you. You're doin' what you gotta do. Don't worry about what others say or think.
User avatar
Romanwild
I live here
 
Posts: 2931
Location: Watertown NY

Postby a-bull » July 25th, 2006, 11:36 am

Here we go again . . .

No one is being "nasty" to Chris. Just because one person does not agree with another person, they aren't being "nasty," "uninformed," "over emotional," etc.

Like I anticipated, all Chris' post did was draw more attention to the situation, and like "babyreba" suggested, cause unnecessary drama.

I agree with Roman, (as much as it pains me, lol . . . teasing, Roman)~

This forum should/could be used to unite pitbull owners towards a common cause. It should not be used as a workingdog vs. "petbull" vs. rescue people forum . . . unless, of course, that is how the Admin. prefer it, at which point we all have the option of participating or not.
DISCLAIMER:

My posts are my own opinions unless otherwise stated. They are not necessarily correct for all dogs or all owners.
a-bull
I live here
 
Posts: 2926

Postby call2arms » July 25th, 2006, 11:37 am

Puh-lease, if Sis didn't speak about Halo right now, but instead in a 3 or 6 months or a year, THAT would cause a ton of drama, people pointing fingers, 'there's something fishy, why didn't you say it right away"blahblah...

Everybody has right for their own emotions, people on this board have them and all, but I'm sure Sis is the one who's more emotional right now... Whatever happens, I just hope that Halo lives the rest of his life in a home where he's happy (not that he' snot with Sis) and I'm confident that it will happen.
User avatar
call2arms
Boys Stink
 
Posts: 2349
Location: sunshine, lollipops and rainbows everywhere...

Postby a-bull » July 25th, 2006, 11:46 am

call2arms wrote:Puh-lease, if Sis didn't speak about Halo right now, but instead in a 3 or 6 months or a year, THAT would cause a ton of drama, people pointing fingers, 'there's something fishy, why didn't you say it right away"blahblah...

Everybody has right for their own emotions, people on this board have them and all, but I'm sure Sis is the one who's more emotional right now... Whatever happens, I just hope that Halo lives the rest of his life in a home where he's happy (not that he' snot with Sis) and I'm confident that it will happen.


Well, right . . . and there will always be finger pointing, and 'something fishies' regardless of what you may do because that's the nature of forums . . . and again, had Sis just briefly explained her situation, there probably would have been far less drama, but that's just my opinion.
DISCLAIMER:

My posts are my own opinions unless otherwise stated. They are not necessarily correct for all dogs or all owners.
a-bull
I live here
 
Posts: 2926

Postby mnp13 » July 25th, 2006, 11:57 am

a-bull wrote:It should not be used as a workingdog vs. "petbull" vs. rescue people forum . . . unless, of course, that is how the Admin. prefer it, at which point we all have the option of participating or not.


There is no "vs" involved here. This forum is for people who own / love / train / support / work Pit Bulls and other bull breeds.

There is often a difference in the "roles" of dogs depending on how many you have and what you do with them. We can respectfully agree to disagree on many topics, and all members are asked to not pass judgement and to at least listen to any opposing opinions.

Many people have commented on the fact that we have managed to keep most of the heated debates civil - and we plan to continue to keep things civil.

Most working dogs are not pets. Yes, some are, but the majority are not. As such, they have different care and different expectations. That does not mean sub-standard, just different. Halo is lucky to be in the situation he is in, I know more than one "working dog" person who would have had him put down.

I prefer to stay out of this particular conversation, as I am not at all un-biased in my opinions. however, I did want to address the comment about the purpose of this board.
Michelle

Inside me is a thin woman trying to get out. I usually shut the bitch up with a martini.
User avatar
mnp13
Evil Overlord
 
Posts: 17234
Location: Rochester, NY

Postby anissa » July 25th, 2006, 12:07 pm

In the end, regardless of what anyone says or thinks.. you are doing whats best for Halo. Please try not to take the questions/comments personally, as hard as it is not to. Sometimes we just need to be reminded that we're all in this for the dogs.. and if a situation isnt working,, we need to put all of our emotions on the back burner and ultimately do whats best for our dogs.

I respect that you've made this heartwrenching decision Sis.
User avatar
anissa
Hyper Adolescent Bully
 
Posts: 263
Location: Fort Drum, NY

Postby SisMorphine » July 25th, 2006, 12:14 pm

Though it may have caused a bit of drama the way it was addressed (yes, perhaps I should have made an official posting first, but hindsight's 20/20), I am still happy that Chris posted that because he was simply sticking up for a friend. It makes me feel a lot better to know that I have someone who backs me up, and does so publicly through the criticism.

A big thank you to those who are not judging my situation/decision.
"All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another." -Anatole France
SisMorphine
They're like service dogs gone wrong.
 
Posts: 9233
Location: PR

Postby a-bull » July 25th, 2006, 12:17 pm

mnp13 wrote:
a-bull wrote:It should not be used as a workingdog vs. "petbull" vs. rescue people forum . . . unless, of course, that is how the Admin. prefer it, at which point we all have the option of participating or not.


There is no "vs" involved here. This forum is for people who own / love / train / support / work Pit Bulls and other bull breeds.

There is often a difference in the "roles" of dogs depending on how many you have and what you do with them. We can respectfully agree to disagree on many topics, and all members are asked to not pass judgement and to at least listen to any opposing opinions.

Many people have commented on the fact that we have managed to keep most of the heated debates civil - and we plan to continue to keep things civil.

Most working dogs are not pets. Yes, some are, but the majority are not. As such, they have different care and different expectations. That does not mean sub-standard, just different. Halo is lucky to be in the situation he is in, I know more than one "working dog" person who would have had him put down.

I prefer to stay out of this particular conversation, as I am not at all un-biased in my opinions. however, I did want to address the comment about the purpose of this board.


Thanks, that was my point . . . I didn't think it was a "vs." forum, but I didn't want to speak for the Admins.
DISCLAIMER:

My posts are my own opinions unless otherwise stated. They are not necessarily correct for all dogs or all owners.
a-bull
I live here
 
Posts: 2926

Postby SpiritFngrz » July 25th, 2006, 12:29 pm

I have a petbull, but I have to admit that being a part of this board has opened my eyes...A LOT. I have an appreciation for the working dogs and the sports/activities that they do. I love watching Chris' movies that he posts because the dogs look like they're having FUN. That being said, I'm glad this forum appears to bring together petbull people as well as working dog people, because I can say I have learned a lot about the other side.
Sis, I applaud you for trying to work Halo since it seems like his previous owners were in no way able to do that for him. You tried, but unfortunately it didn't work out. Halo sounds like a sweetie- fortunately Sis can keep him until he finds a great pet home. And another plus- Mike now has a good home with Sis and he can work! I don't see how any of the dogs are losing out??
User avatar
SpiritFngrz
I live here
 
Posts: 2711
Location: Central Mass.

Postby Marinepits » July 25th, 2006, 12:44 pm

Romanwild wrote:
I have assured Sis that these comments are coming from over emotional and uniformed individuals who are not privy to any of the professional suggestions on my part and the open-minded acceptance on Sis’ part.


I like to say that I have no problem with what she is doing. But I would like to reply to your post anyway.

First thing is that obviously the people that have a problem with what sis is doing aren't the only over emotional ones since you find the need to post about it.

Secondly, since they are uniformed then why don't you post more of your professional suggestions in the training section?

This is a message board and debate and different opinions are what make them what they are. A good thread can sometimes do more to educate then reading a book. A good arguement/dis-agreement can make us truly think and come up with better solutions which, ultimately, on this board, can help the dogs. At least I hope so.

If someone doesn't want to be scrutinized then they shouldn't post their business on a public forum.

More on the topic, I believe it was Bahamutt that wrote a blog recently that talks about the dissention between the pet bull owners and the working dog people. This is a good example of that right here.

Part of our goal with this forum was to try and unite these two parties and maybe bring about some mutual understanding in order to help save the breed and for all of us to better understand each other and the dogs.


I agree with Roman 100%.

With that said, however, I'm glad you (Sis) cleared up what's going on with Halo -- thank you! And I hope it works out to the best for you both.

Now, kick off your Birkenstocks and put on your Docs and TOUGHEN THE HELL UP. :neener:

(And to clarify for the more "sensitive" of our readers, that last sentence is a JOKE. :D )
Never make someone a priority in your life when that someone treats you like an option.
User avatar
Marinepits
Proud Infidel
 
Posts: 15621
Location: New England

Postby Chris Fraize » July 25th, 2006, 1:01 pm

My original post was for a select few folks that didn't approach Sis in a manner of respect and decided to stir the pot and judge her very hard decision from the shadows and thru others.

If you weren't one of these folks than the post had nothing to do with you and was NOT directed at you. If you were one of the folks stirring the pot and judging her based on a lack of information and speculation then the post was directed at you.

I hope everyone learned from it and I certainly respect the opinions of all that posted. Another thing that should be understood, my original post(s) on this topic (as with all my posts) is and are not written in anger or with a certain "tone". If you read it with an angry tone as the narrative voice in your head, please re read it.

Please keep in mind that the decision to return Halo was a very difficult one for Sis and she continues to deal with it on a daily basis.

Let's move on. I'm sure those for whom it was intended received the message.

Again, if you weren't one of those folks, No worries. There is nothing to get upset about.

Safe training,
Chris Fraize
Chris Fraize
Snot Nose Bully Pup
 
Posts: 178
Location: Acton, Maine

Next

Return to Pit Bull Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot]