What constitutes the theft of an "idea" or "design"?

This is where to talk about Pit Bulls!

Postby BigDogBuford » August 31st, 2012, 3:09 pm

amalie79 wrote:Been hearing it around on other forums, too, if it's who I think it is... I also did a little something that she had promised a gift cert. in return for. It was just time that I spent, not money, but it bummed me out. I seem to remember sending some FB messages, too, with no response.


That sucks really hard core. Now I don't believe anything she ever said.
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Postby mnp13 » September 4th, 2012, 11:58 am

If we are talking about Noel, when this (outstanding orders) was brought up to me a while ago (in January to be specific) I asked her directly about it and she told me she was unaware of any outstanding orders that she had not already addressed (as in talked to the person who was waiting on stuff.) If that is not the case, feel free to post the info here so she can see it and follow up.

At that time I was given a link to a thread on P B F, however that forum is not accessible unless you are a member so posting that link here isn't useful, nor do I have a username/password there to view it myself.

If this is not about Noel, I apologize for inferring the wrong information. :)
Last edited by mnp13 on September 4th, 2012, 1:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: to add information and clarify a couple things
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Postby furever_pit » September 4th, 2012, 5:22 pm

The situation was eventually remedied between the collar purchaser and Noel.

It was an outstanding order that carried on for months with no communication to the purchaser (who had already paid) despite emails and possibly phone calls. When the collars finally arrived they were poor quality and started to fall apart pretty quickly. This particular customer has posted about it on BDB on a few occasions. I'm sorry but I don't know how to copy and paste a link on my phone.

It was enough to make me stop referring people to PDG. By and large I suggest Stillwater collars unless someone specifically asks for a custom source. In that case, collar mania is the only other source that I have any personal experience with.
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Postby mnp13 » September 4th, 2012, 6:32 pm

I have to say I am amazed that anything made by Noel would "fall apart pretty quickly." I have collars from her that are more than five years old and my dogs are hard on collars and wear them constantly. And if they did fall apart as you stated (and I'm not implying that you are being untruthful) then I'm quite confident that she would have fixed them.

I have personal experience with a number of people who make collars, only two makers have made collars that stood up to daily, hard use. Noel is one of them.
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Postby furever_pit » September 4th, 2012, 7:36 pm

I have a good collar from her as well. Like I said, I used to recommend her and even defended her products for a period of time.

Pictures of the messed up collar are posted on the other forum as well.

I, however, will no longer recommend PDG as a source.
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Postby mnp13 » September 4th, 2012, 11:15 pm

Would you mind posting a link? I looked but was unable to find it.
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Postby BigDogBuford » September 4th, 2012, 11:23 pm

Maybe this thread? I don't use that forum so I'm not familiar with it.

http://www.bulldogbreeds.com/forum/non- ... an-do.html

or here:

http://www.bulldogbreeds.com/forum/phot ... llars.html
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Postby Hoyden » September 5th, 2012, 6:06 pm

Now Jeannine, you of all people should know that I am all about full disclosure; you and I have experienced that in the past first hand, haven’t we?

It’s ironic that I don’t see customers that I have outstanding orders with posting here. Oh, Right! That’s because they have all been contacted, months ago.

Do yourself a favor, save the drama for the stage. But, in the interest of full disclosure, I’ll list all open orders and Gift Certificates below.

I haven’t been hiding, dodging customers, stealing money or any of the other nefarious things you have convinced yourself that I have been up to. I simply got divorced from an abusive man and spent the greater part of last year living away from my house & going to my workshop when my ex was not around in order to keep my daughter, my dog and myself safe from him.

Last fall, in the midst of that nightmare, I met a wonderful man. At the beginning of January, Paul moved me, Gremlin, Birdie and all of our stuff (including my workshop & tools) from CT out to Alameda, CA so we could be with him. He had orders to Galveston, TX for summer 2012, so he rented a small apartment for us and we put the majority of my belongings, including my workshop & tools into storage.

For my own safety, I stopped posting EVERYWHERE late last fall, except for on heavily filtered FaceBook posts. During the 6.5 months in Alameda, I worked on getting my daughter, my dog and myself healthy, so all internet activity other than FB was put aside.

We left Alameda at the end of July and drove to Texas. Our household goods were delivered on August 12th. I just started unpacking my workshop and putting it into order on August 22.

I have been in contact with everyone who has any outstanding business with me. Everyone was told MONTHS ago that once I got to Texas & got my workshop put together, I would complete outstanding orders and make good on all of them.

With the exception of one of individual, everyone with outstanding business with me is on my friends list on FB. They all have seen my updates, they all know what is going on in my life.


OUTSTANDING ORDERS:
(All materials are cut, they just require assembly)

EN
(1) 3/4” fabric side release dog collar
(1) 2” silver webbing collar with black dagged center stripe
RD Project: Collar & matching harness – no charge

CF
(2) 3/4” fabric collars
(2) 3/4" matching fabric harnesses – gift in exchange for pics of harnesses on dogs
(1) 1.25” brown leather collar w/ brass gilt domes
RD Project: Collar & matching harness – no charge

JM
(1) 2” custom leather martingale
(1) 2” webbing martingale collar – Make good for shipping snafu
There was a major shipping snafu with this collar that was not my fault. I remade the collar and made another as a make-good and shipped it. I don’t know the status of this order, so it’s open until I find the box that the paper work is in and can contact the customer.


REPAIR:

TM ~ No charge
(1) Repair stitching on S collar
(1) Switch out hardware on second collar at customer request
(1) Replace leather leash due to defect in the leather.
(1) 2” pink webbing collar w/ lavender lining – make good for leash


GIFT CERTIFICATES:

KF
(1) 1.25” to 1” custom pink leather collar
(1) Ribbon over webbing collar, customer’s choice – make good due to shipping snafu & wait time.
(There was a shipping issue with this collar, customer knows details. 3rd collar is cut, just needs to be sewn up and blinged.)

ES – Balance of $23.60 remaining
(1) 1” fabric side release collar – I
(1) 1.5” fabric martingale collar – P
(Fabric is cut & embroidered, the collars just need to be assembled)

AW - $25.00
TW - $50.00
Pai - $50.00

There is one other GC that was is owed for a project. I can not remember the person’s user name or their RL name for the life of me. If they contact me, I will honor it.


DISPUTES:

LR - Claims that I did not refund him for an order that he placed & has been running his mouth all over just stating that I did not refund him. Paypal dispute was found in my favor.

He ordered a leather collar and put in the notes that he wanted spikes in place of certain spots. I told him I do not put spikes on collars, told him his options from what I had on hand or could order or told him he could have a refund. He insisted on spikes. I refunded his money in full.

A week later, spikes arrive in the mail with a note that they are for this order number. I contact the customer to make arrangement to send them to him or back to the vendor. He insisted I make him a collar and again, sent me the money via paypal. He got ugly, swearing at me via email & instructed me to send him the M-fing spikes and bill him for the shipping. So I refunded him the money, less priority shipping to send the spikes to him.

He filed a dispute with paypal. Paypal reviewed the emails, correspondence and found in my favor.
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Postby furever_pit » September 5th, 2012, 10:06 pm

Wow. You've been through a lot. Certainly explains the online absence that I observed.
Glad to hear that you have found a better life for you and your family.
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Postby TinaMartin » September 6th, 2012, 8:07 am

I did not post on anything out of respect for Noels privacy. I was one of the individuals who knew SOME of what was going on and knowing what a bad nasty divorce from a dirt bag can be like chose to just quietly wait it out. I know that Noel will be sending my collars and replacement leash when she gets things put together where she is now. I do however find it kind of ironic that this gets dragged out of the woodwork JUST as she is putting everything together to start up again.
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Postby Hoyden » September 6th, 2012, 2:42 pm

furever_pit wrote:Wow. You've been through a lot. Certainly explains the online absence that I observed.
Glad to hear that you have found a better life for you and your family.


Thank you. We have been through hell and back, but now we are all okay and very happy now. The last part of 2012 was horrible and frightening. Since we left CT, we did a lot of healing, had some awesome adventures and made some great progress on our mission to address BSL on Military Installations.

I married a man who is a WWII Militaria Collector, he fuels my historical dog research and enables me horribly by buying photos, books, post cards, brasses, figurines and other memorabilia. What ever I decide to do, he will support me 150%.

In short, I left a nightmare and walking into a Fairy Tale. One of these days, I will share the details, but not today.
Moral courage is the most valuable and usually the most absent characteristic in men ~ General George S. Patton, Jr.

She taking all the stars down from her sky to hang them up someplace new, where there's better weather and the sky's a different blue. ~ Autumn Fields
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Postby Hoyden » September 6th, 2012, 2:57 pm

Oh, I don't want to forget these.....

It seems that Rebecca still has no respect for other people's work & is more than happy to troll the FB pages of her competitors and steal ideas. These posts from earlier this year were brought to my attention after Jeanine decided to bring this old topic up.

http://www.namastedogs.com/ellas-lead-why-i-wont-shop-there/

http://www.chihuahuasarenotsheep.com/2011/08/ellas-lead-collar-review.html

I don't know either of these people.


On that note, I was contacted by two other collar businesses earlier this year with complaints that Rebecca /Ella's Lead had stolen designs from them. It was very very obvious that she took a rather unique design, made a few minor changes and started selling them.

At the time I was contacted, I just did not have the emotional ability or the desire to deal with it, so I advised them that they should make a public post about it and come here to add on to this post if they'd like.

Make no mistake about it, there are others with the same complaints about Rebecca and Ella's Lead stealing designs and the inferior quality of her work, they just don't want to deal with the backlash and Rebecca's nastiness, so they don't make a big public stink about it.
Moral courage is the most valuable and usually the most absent characteristic in men ~ General George S. Patton, Jr.

She taking all the stars down from her sky to hang them up someplace new, where there's better weather and the sky's a different blue. ~ Autumn Fields
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Postby WolfMoon » September 6th, 2012, 9:38 pm

I've been there with Noel through the hell that manifested in her life and watched as her life climbed out of that fiery pit and became happy once more. It was NOT my place to even mention what was going on but I reassured people on various forums since I talk to Noel regularly. She's an honest, worthwhile person who does what she says and I believe her.

To sit her and try and stir the pot when you were not privy to the goings on other than hearsay is ridiculous.
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