Schutzhund turns

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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 17th, 2010, 3:45 pm

I don't know if that's the official name of them, but that turn where I turn around in one direction and Inara circles behind me going the other way and ends up back in a heel position.

Anyway, for those of you who use this turn, do you have a cue for it? If not, how does your dog know when to do that turn as opposed to staying on your left and just doing an about turn?
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Postby furever_pit » July 17th, 2010, 3:57 pm

Oooh, good question.
I never taught that little flip turn thing to Dylan. He's not bright enough so we keep it to the basics. lol
It looks awesome when it's done right though.

Gotta love that flashy SchH obedience.
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Postby katiek0417 » July 17th, 2010, 6:13 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:I don't know if that's the official name of them, but that turn where I turn around in one direction and Inara circles behind me going the other way and ends up back in a heel position.

Anyway, for those of you who use this turn, do you have a cue for it? If not, how does your dog know when to do that turn as opposed to staying on your left and just doing an about turn?


It's a Schutzhund about turn...

I taught Sacha how to do it, and when I was doing OB with Nemo, he was doing it (we haven't done anything lately b/c of the injury)...

I don't have a cue with the two of them...it's just something that I never allowed them to do it any other way...and I used a lot of food to bait them and get them to go the way I wanted them to (it also helps if you have good leash handling because it does require you to switch hands in the middle of the turn)...

Seriously, though...consistency, and not letting them do it the other way is key...So, once you start teaching it, don't go back and do it the other way sometimes...it always has to be the Sch about turn...
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Postby TheRedQueen » July 17th, 2010, 6:36 pm

Isn't it used in Rally too? There is a word for it in Rally, I thought...
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 17th, 2010, 6:57 pm

Katie, that's what I was figuring, that I'd just have to be consistent with it. I know it's harder to do (especially on leash!) but it just looks so damned impressive!
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Postby katiek0417 » July 17th, 2010, 7:27 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:Katie, that's what I was figuring, that I'd just have to be consistent with it. I know it's harder to do (especially on leash!) but it just looks so damned impressive!


Once you get the action of switching the leash to the different hand, you'll be fine...It's weird at first, but then it become second nature...

One way that worked for me to teach it was to stand with my dog in the heel position, hold the leash with my right hand, hot dog in my left hand, step forward with my right foot while guiding the dog forward with the hot dog. Then pivot towards the left (since my right foot was forward), pass the food to the right hand (with the leash still in that hand), then as my pivot brings me to facing the opposite direction fully, reach behind back, and pass food and leash to left hand...then bring my right foot up to meet my left...then I'd keep repeating that (well, as many times as I could before getting dizzy :rolleyes2: )

Both my dogs are really food motivated, so it easiest for me to do it this way, and use the food to guide them into the position I wanted...I also found that this was the easiest way to keep the dog as close as possible while doing the loop thing (so the dog doesn't get out of step)...

TheRedQueen wrote:Isn't it used in Rally too? There is a word for it in Rally, I thought...


I don't know...I've always seen it in Schutzhund...so I just knew it from that...it may be used in Rally as well...
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 17th, 2010, 7:32 pm

I found that it is called a "Left About Turn" in Rally.
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Postby TheRedQueen » July 17th, 2010, 9:30 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:I found that it is called a "Left About Turn" in Rally.



YES! thank you! :) I was racking my brain...lol
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Postby Hundilein » July 17th, 2010, 9:45 pm

If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, I started teaching it to Hannah for Rally. I called it "whee!". I believe I started out using a hand target to lure her and then moved up to just telling her "go whee!" as I started my turn. She picked it up pretty quickly. I can't remember if I've done it with Renee. Maybe I'll try it with her this weekend. If I do, I'll try to remember to video tape it so I can see how I do it.
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Postby TheRedQueen » July 17th, 2010, 10:02 pm

Hundilein wrote:If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, I started teaching it to Hannah for Rally. I called it "whee!". I believe I started out using a hand target to lure her and then moved up to just telling her "go whee!" as I started my turn. She picked it up pretty quickly. I can't remember if I've done it with Renee. Maybe I'll try it with her this weekend. If I do, I'll try to remember to video tape it so I can see how I do it.



Hee hee...I wanna see the video just so I can laugh at your "whee"...I'm sure it's adorable with your accent! :D
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 17th, 2010, 10:12 pm

Wheeee!!!! I like that, lol . I think I will put it on a cue since she still will need to know a regular about turn as well...
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Postby Malli » July 18th, 2010, 2:42 am

yeah I was introduced to it as a left about turn I believe, never did figure it out lol.
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Postby katiek0417 » July 18th, 2010, 8:40 am

pitbullmamaliz wrote:Wheeee!!!! I like that, lol . I think I will put it on a cue since she still will need to know a regular about turn as well...


Will you be using the turn in obedience trials or Schutzhund? So, I mean are you teaching it just for fun, or because you'll need it?
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 18th, 2010, 8:46 am

I know I will need a regular about turn for obedience trials - not sure if they require a Schutz. turn at higher levels. So for now I'm teaching it just for fun and because it looks really good, but I may need it later. I'm really enjoying taking classes and competing and may branch into Rally or something else that requires it. Definitely not for Schutzhund. :wink:
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Postby katiek0417 » July 18th, 2010, 2:42 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:I know I will need a regular about turn for obedience trials - not sure if they require a Schutz. turn at higher levels. So for now I'm teaching it just for fun and because it looks really good, but I may need it later. I'm really enjoying taking classes and competing and may branch into Rally or something else that requires it. Definitely not for Schutzhund. :wink:



Well, they do have OB1, 2, and 3 for Schutzhund :wink: and the BH...

Just be aware that most times when you would need it (rally, etc), you won't be able to give an extra command - you'll lose points...

That's why I've taught my dogs to just do it....
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 18th, 2010, 3:09 pm

But then how would I work it when she still needs to know a regular about turn? Such a conundrum!

I can't even imagine Inara in a Schutzhund competition! lol
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Postby katiek0417 » July 18th, 2010, 3:27 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:But then how would I work it when she still needs to know a regular about turn? Such a conundrum!

I can't even imagine Inara in a Schutzhund competition! lol


You may have to do the left about turn as a schutzhund turn, then the right about turn as a regular one...does that make sense...if you do it that way then use a shoulder drop as a cue (you make the drop pronounced at first, then more subtle as she understands), then you may accomplish the same thing without having to say anything...so for the right about turn, drop the left shoulder (since you're leading with the left leg) and for the left about turn, drop the right shoulder...I found that there is a "science" to doing turns for competition that will keep your dog correct (and apparently people in all venues: both AKC and UKC OB and rally, Schutzhund, ring, etc know about this...but unless someone tells you, you don't figure it out on your own) and it keeps the turns as perfect 90 degrees......let me see if I can find some footprint clip art and I'll put them in a diagram...
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 18th, 2010, 3:44 pm

Cripes, I haven't been paying attention to which leg I lead my turns with. I'm still trying to remember to always start heeling with my left leg (and failing!). I'm trying to think how I turn...thinking about it, I feel like if I want to turn left, either a basic left or a left about, I lead with my left leg. Maybe because I'm not doing super sharp turns yet since we're still learning? Are you saying that a left turn starts with the right leg and vice versa because once we're good enough my one foot (the inside foot) will just be a pivot point?
"Remember - every time your dog gets somewhere on a tight leash *a fairy dies and it's all your fault.* Think of the fairies." http://www.positivepetzine.com"

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Postby katiek0417 » July 18th, 2010, 6:38 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:Cripes, I haven't been paying attention to which leg I lead my turns with. I'm still trying to remember to always start heeling with my left leg (and failing!). I'm trying to think how I turn...thinking about it, I feel like if I want to turn left, either a basic left or a left about, I lead with my left leg. Maybe because I'm not doing super sharp turns yet since we're still learning? Are you saying that a left turn starts with the right leg and vice versa because once we're good enough my one foot (the inside foot) will just be a pivot point?


Right...it's hard to explain without a diagram, but it's a 3-step turn (meaning 3 foot positions) or a 4-step about turn...and the first foot position is always with the foot opposite to which you want to turn...
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 18th, 2010, 6:47 pm

Do you know if there is a diagram on any Sch sites that show what you're talking about? I'm just not getting how a turn could be 3-4 steps.

Thanks for all your help!
"Remember - every time your dog gets somewhere on a tight leash *a fairy dies and it's all your fault.* Think of the fairies." http://www.positivepetzine.com"

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