Knee again

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Postby mnp13 » July 6th, 2010, 7:41 pm

I can't remember if we posted about it when it first happened, but back in mid-March (the 14th to be exact), Connor jumped out of the car and wiped out hard on some ice and twisted his knee badly. He wouldn't put weight on it for days, but after a while, began to slowly walk normally. We carefully added in normal activity and things seemed to be progressing well.

Well, no such luck, he did ok with Inara at pinup weekend - no limping even after some hard play; though we kept their humpy time rather brief.

This weekend we were up at camp, and he's back to holding it up and skipping most if not every step. *sigh* He'll put it down for a few steps at most, but can't do stairs at all. Everything we've looked up; and read from people's experience here and on other forums, indicates that it's probably a partial tear of the ACL. fan-freekin-tastic.
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Postby madremissy » July 6th, 2010, 8:26 pm

Awww, Good thoughts to Connor. I am sorry Michelle. Let's hope it is not as bad as it sounds.
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Postby mnp13 » July 6th, 2010, 8:36 pm

Thanks. We just iced for 20 minutes on the couch... it was rough for him... 20 minutes of lying on his back getting belly rubs and trying to lie still. lol It's harder trying to keep the stupid thing in place, which is what we're working on right now.
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Postby Ino » July 6th, 2010, 8:40 pm

Sorry to hear about Connor. :( I hope he recovers from his knee problem soon. Ino had a partial tear in one knee and ended up with one in the other from favoring it. He was very young when his problem first appeared (under 6 mo.). I think his had to do with his odd build (his upper body/head is wide like his English Bulldog mom and his butt end is more like his Pit Bull dad). His injury was either from a slide on the ice running with the lab in the driveway or trying to pivot too sharp when playing with her. Since he was under 6mo old at the time, I was scared about opting for surgery unless all other options were explored and failed. Our normal vet told me restrict activities (swimming was ok) and see what happens. He would stop limping for a while but it kept returning. I was real nervous when he said he did not do the surgery so I would have to go to a different vet for it. We ended up trying a holistic vet near Woodstock, who gave me some different holistic joint meds.I am not sure if that is what healed him or if maybe age was on his side- but he has not had issues with the knees in over a year and is now able to run and romp like he was not able to during his puppy months. I am not sure if it is going to be something that will come back up in the future and will require surgery, but I just did not feel it was good for him because he was still growing. Atleast he sounds like a good sport about it- Ino used to run from me when I had the ice pack or the heating pad (pillowcase with rice that I would microwave to warm it up- he would run when the microwave beeped).Best wishes for Connor.
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Postby amazincc » July 6th, 2010, 8:58 pm

:shock: Oh, noooo... :sad2:

Sending a boat-load of good thoughts and healing vibes to one of my favorite boys... :heartbeat: :hug3:
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Postby TheRedQueen » July 6th, 2010, 9:02 pm

So sorry to hear this...Xander's been going through ACL issues for almost 2 years now...it reallys sucks. :(

Here's a video that shows dogs with ACL tears and discusses the way they walk...toe touching is a big symptom from what I've seen.
http://www.fidosfriend.com/Home_Page.php
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Postby amazincc » July 6th, 2010, 9:04 pm

mnp13 wrote:Thanks. We just iced for 20 minutes on the couch... it was rough for him... 20 minutes of lying on his back getting belly rubs and trying to lie still. lol It's harder trying to keep the stupid thing in place, which is what we're working on right now.



Do you have any vet wrap handy???


Or... duct tape... :P
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Postby mnp13 » July 6th, 2010, 9:30 pm

TheRedQueen wrote:So sorry to hear this...Xander's been going through ACL issues for almost 2 years now...it reallys sucks. :(

Here's a video that shows dogs with ACL tears and discusses the way they walk...toe touching is a big symptom from what I've seen.
http://www.fidosfriend.com/Home_Page.php


I'd definitely like to see the video, but that's not the link... :wink:

We're only a few miles from the lake, so if swimming is part of the rehab, then we should be able to do that.
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 6th, 2010, 9:42 pm

Poor handsome man! Inara obviously sends LOTS of filthy perverted love his way, as do I (only in a non filthy/perverted manner, of course). Lots of good thoughts that it's not his ACL.
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Postby TheRedQueen » July 6th, 2010, 9:49 pm

Sorry! Guess it didn't copy! :D
Here's the link:
http://accad.osu.edu/~hcaprett/COTA_741 ... 90504.html
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Postby Ino » July 6th, 2010, 9:53 pm

Our vet told me Ino could swim since it was a non-impact activity. He told me limit walking as much as possible and no running for atleast a few months to give him time to heal. Easier said than done- but since he is mixed with English Bulldog- he tired quicker than most pups his age would have, so I was lucky. I did have to walk him into the water slowly on leash since he otherwise would run into the water like a madman if we were on land when I let him off leash (his swimming area is on my landlord's property in the middle of nowhere in the woods). I definately think the swimming played a major role in his healing. Land activities just seemed to allow him to reinjure it and he kept trying to play like nothing was wrong. :rolleyes2:
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Postby Malli » July 7th, 2010, 2:47 am

I would try to rest Connor as much as possible. After a prolonged rest period (I'd think 6 weeks +) then low impact might be ok.

Even when my vet suspected Oscar had a sprain he said 6 weeks rest - no leash walks, just out to potty and back.

So anyway, I'd be careful ;)
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Postby TinaMartin » July 7th, 2010, 8:02 am

Poor Connor! Sorsha sends lots of slurps his way.
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Postby maberi » July 7th, 2010, 9:17 am

The vet can do a drawer test in office to see how much "play" there is in the knee. It's definitely not the most informative test in the world but they can tell how loose the knee is which would give you a better idea if there is a possible tear in the knee. Depending on how compliant Connor is, they can usually do the test without sedation.
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Postby LMM » July 7th, 2010, 9:57 am

Lots of good thoughts for Connor :(
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Postby PetieMarie22 » July 7th, 2010, 10:07 am

Awe! I hope Conner feels better! Poor guy!
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Postby Ino » July 7th, 2010, 10:41 am

Malli wrote:I would try to rest Connor as much as possible. After a prolonged rest period (I'd think 6 weeks +) then low impact might be ok.

Even when my vet suspected Oscar had a sprain he said 6 weeks rest - no leash walks, just out to potty and back.

So anyway, I'd be careful ;)

It has been a while since Ino first tore his and you refreshed my memory :oops: - Ino was on the same thing for the 1st 6 weeks...pee breaks only (no run/jump/stairs/car trips)-then low impact activity. Thanks for posting that!!
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Postby HappyPuppy » July 7th, 2010, 12:44 pm

Dangit! I know recovery/rest time will be hard on ALL of you! Best of luck ans wishes for a lesser injury!
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Postby katiek0417 » July 7th, 2010, 12:56 pm

Ugh...Michelle, I'm sorry...

You know I'm not new to ACL injuries.

I will argue with one thing people have said on here...everyone is saying that swimming is the best exercise/rehab for an ACL tear because it is low impact...however, VOSM told me there's a ton of newer research saying that that is NOT the case. The way dogs swim requires a motion that can turn a partial tear into a full tear. I had thought it would be the best thing, and when Nemo partially tore his ACL (even at the time of surgery which was 5 months later, it was only about 20% torn, but it was very stretched out), they told me that it can lead to a full tear. Instead, they recommended the underwater treadmill. They said, first and foremost, it's a regular walking action (so no weird kicking like you have in swimming). Second, they said that they are able to regulate how much effort the dog has to put into it simply by increasing or decreasing the level of the water (as well as the incline on the treadmill). So, more water, means less effort for the dog, less of a chance of more injury to the joint. But they still have the resistance which leads to increased muscle mass...

Even now (post-surgery), I was told that Nemo would not be allowed to go swimming until his bone was fully fused and healed (about 12 weeks post-op).

Nemo did the underwater treadmill 1-2x weekly from late-February to (about 5 weeks post-injury) late May (surgery was May 25th), and they said that his muscle mass in his legs was incredible, and probably masking a lot of the pain he was feeling.

If you have any questions, feel free to call me...I did a ton of research on dogs and knees when Nemo injured himself...

Oh, and I agree...if you can find vet wrap to keep the ice pack on, it would be good...
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Postby maberi » July 7th, 2010, 1:17 pm

katiek0417 wrote:Oh, and I agree...if you can find vet wrap to keep the ice pack on, it would be good...


Country Max sells the horse vet wrap that works really well. We used that and a bag of frozen peas on Earl's leg for his daily icings
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