Very bad news from the Vet today.

Food, Fitness and how to keep them healthy.

Postby Rolex+Deebo » April 2nd, 2010, 2:33 pm

blabsforbullies wrote:Was the concentration of the urine (1.010) the very first morning urine? That tends to be the best concentration value for checking kidney function. Also, a good indication as to how the kidneys are functioning is by checking the protein/ ratio.

I have patients that have both cardiac and renal disease, and it isn't easy to deal with sometimes. To treat one, you could make the other worse. I think having the cardiologist evaluate the function is a great place to start.

Yes, the teeth are important, but wait to find out what the status of the heart function is before trying anything. It's also important to monitor what you do with respect to the kidneys too, because sometime the bones, etc have high protein levels and that isn't good for the kidneys.

I am so sorry. I hope it isn't as bad as it initially looks, and we are sending good thoughts your way! :goodthoughts:



The urine concentration was 10/10, normal is 10/30, and a dehydrated dog is 10/40. So his kidneys are not holding any water. Thats why he drinks/pees so much. And because his creatinine level is 2.7(?) and the norm is below1.8(?) And the RNN(?) was 28 which is on the high side of normal (normal ends at 29) So the kidneys are not filtering like they should ether. So the kidneys are not doing jack $hit! I need to find a food that is low in protein, and phosphate(?) anyone know of a good one?
We will see what the Cardio. says.
Thanks again for all the love!
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Scahill's Goddess Of Light CGC TDI ~aka~ Ziva

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Postby maberi » April 2nd, 2010, 2:42 pm

Good thoughts coming your way.

Are you guys going to the specialists across from MCC?
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Postby Malli » April 2nd, 2010, 3:36 pm

If you want to look for foods outside of prescription diets, I'd suggest looking at the protein content of the prescription diets and finding a food that matches.
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Postby Rolex+Deebo » April 3rd, 2010, 11:36 am

maberi wrote:Good thoughts coming your way.

Are you guys going to the specialists across from MCC?



yup, why?

If you want to look for foods outside of prescription diets, I'd suggest looking at the protein content of the prescription diets and finding a food that matches.


thats what I was going to do. I cant spend no $40 on a 10lbs bag! LOL

Tank you for your thoughts. :)
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Deebo ~aka~ Slobber Monkey
Scahill's Goddess Of Light CGC TDI ~aka~ Ziva

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Postby amazincc » April 3rd, 2010, 12:38 pm

I just got this e-mail from a former member...

Rolex and Deebo and the heart/kidney situation

may be able to get GREAT care but lower cost by going to cornell vet college in Ithica.... not that far from Rochester....

I can't post but if you wanted to suggest that it might be a good idea.


I don't know anything about it, but you may want to check it out??? :hug3:
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Postby blabsforbullies » April 4th, 2010, 8:10 pm

Rolex+Deebo wrote:The urine concentration was 10/10, normal is 10/30, and a dehydrated dog is 10/40. So his kidneys are not holding any water. Thats why he drinks/pees so much. And because his creatinine level is 2.7(?) and the norm is below1.8(?) And the RNN(?) was 28 which is on the high side of normal (normal ends at 29) So the kidneys are not filtering like they should ether. So the kidneys are not doing jack $hit! I need to find a food that is low in protein, and phosphate(?) anyone know of a good one?
We will see what the Cardio. says.
Thanks again for all the love!



Yes, I understand what you are saying (I am a veterinarian) and I agree, the kidneys are not working properly. A specific gravity of 1.010 isn't good, but my point was that getting the first morning urine is often the best sample to evaluate how little or how much the kidneys are able to concentrate. It's neither here nor there, as it is evident the kidneys are not working 100%, but I was just trying to help.

At a continuing education seminar I recently attended, they suggested that evaluating the amount of protein in the urine (there should be none, ideally) can help determine the prognosis and may help treat early stages of renal disease (based on the values of the creatinine and BUN (blood urea nitrogen) you posted, this may be the case for your dog).

Looks like you have it covered, and I hope the cardiologist can help shed some light as to what to do for your dog. Good luck and I will hope for the best!
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Postby Rolex+Deebo » April 5th, 2010, 11:28 pm

Rolex and Deebo and the heart/kidney situation
may be able to get GREAT care but lower cost by going to cornell vet college in Ithica.... not that far from Rochester....
I can't post but if you wanted to suggest that it might be a good idea.
I don't know anything about it, but you may want to check it out???


Thank you, I will have to check that out! Anything to save some $! LOL

Yes, I understand what you are saying (I am a veterinarian) and I agree, the kidneys are not working properly. A specific gravity of 1.010 isn't good, but my point was that getting the first morning urine is often the best sample to evaluate how little or how much the kidneys are able to concentrate. It's neither here nor there, as it is evident the kidneys are not working 100%, but I was just trying to help.

At a continuing education seminar I recently attended, they suggested that evaluating the amount of protein in the urine (there should be none, ideally) can help determine the prognosis and may help treat early stages of renal disease (based on the values of the creatinine and BUN (blood urea nitrogen) you posted, this may be the case for your dog).

Looks like you have it covered, and I hope the cardiologist can help shed some light as to what to do for your dog. Good luck and I will hope for the best!


Thank you so much for trying to help, I apologize is I sounded cranky. I am just t a loss right now.
I think we are going to try to do food/suplements to help the kidneys. And meds for the heart. I know the heart meds will hurt the kidneys, but I dont know what else to do.
Here is some info from a frien who works for a vet, their Vet tech has a dog with the same heart issues. But not the kidneys. So Im not sure how thats going to go
VetMedin (pimobendan). Here's a website for Vetmedin: http://www.vetmedin-us.com/ . I've seen it work wonders. I knew what side heart failure it's supposed to help, but I can't remember right now. Then, our vets usually add Spironolactone, which is a diuretic. And I think the dogs are also on salix (lasix), and they use enalapril, but now sure if it's in conjunction with the others. Then, there are some heart support supplements that Jen gives her dog in CHF.


Let me know what you think. :confused:
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Deebo ~aka~ Slobber Monkey
Scahill's Goddess Of Light CGC TDI ~aka~ Ziva

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Postby blabsforbullies » April 6th, 2010, 7:13 pm

I use vetmedin a lot with dogs that are in heart failure. It is a fairly new drup to the USA (was available in Canada for quite some time prior). The less medication the better for the kidneys, but obviously the cardiologist will know that. :wink:

I hope things go better for you & your fur kid... I know how stressful and upsetting this must be for you. :sad2:
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