Florida -- Training a Protection Dog?

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Postby EmJayFLa » October 16th, 2009, 10:53 pm

does anybody know a trainer in central fla. who is willing to help train an apbt in protection?
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Postby furever_pit » October 16th, 2009, 10:59 pm

EmJayFLa wrote:does anybody know a trainer in central fla. who is willing to help train an apbt in protection?


This should really be another thread.
But, where are you? I train both my dogs in Schutzhund and I live in FL.
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Postby mnp13 » October 17th, 2009, 10:34 am

Where specifically? And do you mean bite sport (PSA, French Ring, Schutzhund, etc) or actual personal protection? Some trainers don't make a distinction, they are quite different
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Postby EmJayFLa » October 20th, 2009, 10:49 am

mnp13 wrote:Where specifically? And do you mean bite sport (PSA, French Ring, Schutzhund, etc) or actual personal protection? Some trainers don't make a distinction, they are quite different


Looking into all of the above right now to find out what ages to start training what type of training is usually used what kind of traits the dog needs to exhibit that sort of thing and narrow it down from there. For example in shutzhund and french ring I have heard that some trainers are able to train only in prey drive, is it the same for personal protection or do they train differently. Right now I just have general questions and I'll decide from there which is right for them.
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Postby DemoDick » October 20th, 2009, 11:13 pm

EmJayFLa wrote:
mnp13 wrote:Where specifically? And do you mean bite sport (PSA, French Ring, Schutzhund, etc) or actual personal protection? Some trainers don't make a distinction, they are quite different


Looking into all of the above right now to find out what ages to start training what type of training is usually used what kind of traits the dog needs to exhibit that sort of thing and narrow it down from there. For example in shutzhund and french ring I have heard that some trainers are able to train only in prey drive, is it the same for personal protection or do they train differently. Right now I just have general questions and I'll decide from there which is right for them.


Sch. and Ring dogs can be trained using almost exclusively what is typically called "prey drive." Personal Protection dogs need to be balanced in both prey and defense, and I personally prefer a dog that comes from a combat (or "fight drive" if you like) mentality if he is going to be trained in practical biting. But prey and defense are a must.

In general, bitework dogs will benefit from learning the basic behaviors of biting as early as possible in the context of a game, like teaching a child martial arts or boxing. It's not serious or sressful in this stage. As the dog matures he should be assessed to determine whether or not he has the correct mindset to handle situations that will bring out defense drive. Some dogs are comfortable in defense and some are not. Some lack prey altogether but will work in defense and can be transitioned into prey. Some are prey-oriented until they mature and will stay that way unless defense is purposely triggered. In short, there's no pattern set in stone that must be followed. Each dog is different and will take a slightly different path, and relatively few dogs bring the correct genetic potential to the plate to begin with.

The only thing I will tell you for sure is that it is a good idea find a reputable club or trainer with titles (or tournaments in the case of PP) under their belt and spend a lot of time watching them develop dogs of different ages. Get a look at their personal dogs and ask yourself if their dogs are the kind you would want to have for yourself. Dogs are a reflection of their trainers, and not every trainer has the same expectations of behavior and lifestyle. Never try to train your own dog as an amatuer. This type of training must be learned first-hand, and it's not something to experiment around with.

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Postby katiek0417 » October 21st, 2009, 9:25 am

DemoDick wrote:
Sch. and Ring dogs can be trained using almost exclusively what is typically called "prey drive." Personal Protection dogs need to be balanced in both prey and defense, and I personally prefer a dog that comes from a combat (or "fight drive" if you like) mentality if he is going to be trained in practical biting. But prey and defense are a must.

In general, bitework dogs will benefit from learning the basic behaviors of biting as early as possible in the context of a game, like teaching a child martial arts or boxing. It's not serious or sressful in this stage. As the dog matures he should be assessed to determine whether or not he has the correct mindset to handle situations that will bring out defense drive. Some dogs are comfortable in defense and some are not. Some lack prey altogether but will work in defense and can be transitioned into prey. Some are prey-oriented until they mature and will stay that way unless defense is purposely triggered. In short, there's no pattern set in stone that must be followed. Each dog is different and will take a slightly different path, and relatively few dogs bring the correct genetic potential to the plate to begin with.

The only thing I will tell you for sure is that it is a good idea find a reputable club or trainer with titles (or tournaments in the case of PP) under their belt and spend a lot of time watching them develop dogs of different ages. Get a look at their personal dogs and ask yourself if their dogs are the kind you would want to have for yourself. Dogs are a reflection of their trainers, and not every trainer has the same expectations of behavior and lifestyle. Never try to train your own dog as an amatuer. This type of training must be learned first-hand, and it's not something to experiment around with.

Demo Dick



:thumbsup: Agreed! Excellent post, Demo!
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Postby mnp13 » October 21st, 2009, 3:34 pm

EmJayFLa wrote:
mnp13 wrote:Where specifically? And do you mean bite sport (PSA, French Ring, Schutzhund, etc) or actual personal protection? Some trainers don't make a distinction, they are quite different


Looking into all of the above right now to find out what ages to start training what type of training is usually used what kind of traits the dog needs to exhibit that sort of thing and narrow it down from there. For example in shutzhund and french ring I have heard that some trainers are able to train only in prey drive, is it the same for personal protection or do they train differently. Right now I just have general questions and I'll decide from there which is right for them.


I guess I should have phrased my question differently, what are you interested in specifically? The sports themselves are vastly different, and PP is separate from all of them.

Schutzhund is rigidly patterned to the point of almost being stylized. You also have tracking, though not a style of tracking that is used much outside of shutzhund (as in it doesn't really transfer to search and rescue for example.)

The ring sports are somewhat similar to each other, but quite different from PSA.

When you get to personal protection, all bets are off - do a search for DSO in the sports section to see some pictures from the personal protection trial that a few of us from the forum have been to for the past few years.

I see what you're saying about finding out which is right for them, but it's important to know which is right for you too. :wink:
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