To Rabies Vaccinate or Not?

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Postby TheRedQueen » October 14th, 2009, 2:41 pm

DemoDick wrote:Too much fear-mongering going on. Do we really NEED to vaccinate every kid for chicken pox, the flu, H1N1, halitosis, etc? No, we don't.


I'm really thinking Halitosis vaccinations should be mandatory for some folks... :dance: Just saying.
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Postby DemoDick » October 14th, 2009, 2:55 pm

TheRedQueen wrote:
DemoDick wrote:Too much fear-mongering going on. Do we really NEED to vaccinate every kid for chicken pox, the flu, H1N1, halitosis, etc? No, we don't.


I'm really thinking Halitosis vaccinations should be mandatory for some folks... :dance: Just saying.


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Postby mnp13 » October 14th, 2009, 3:16 pm

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Postby Malli » October 14th, 2009, 3:38 pm

DemoDick wrote:I'm not big on vaccines, myself. For people or animals. Too much fear-mongering going on. Do we really NEED to vaccinate every kid for chicken pox, the flu, H1N1, halitosis, etc? No, we don't. Compromised populations like the elderly? Inject away if they want it. Otherwise, let a healthy immune system do its job and it will stay tuned up. Unless we're talking about lethal bugs. In which case...

Thats the thing, Distemper IS fatal, The dog has a 50% chance at survival from Parvo, even with treatment. Not all, but a substantial portion of the vaccines dogs get are for fatal.
Most things that people vaccinate themselves for have a substantial chance of survival (unless they are immune compramised - elderly, children or infants, sick), there are treatments that can ease the symptoms and help the person's immune system fight the infection - like treating Bordatella : bad cases need some IV fluids and perhaps antibiotics for a secondary infection or pneumonia. The various forms of the flu and chicken pox etc that are often vaccinated for can easily be survived in a healthy person, the same cannot be said for several illness regularly vaccinated for in dogs.

DemoDick wrote:I still get nervous at every vaccination. I don't vaccinate for everything (bordatella? WTF?), and actually prefer to vaccinate much less than most people. But I'm also not going to risk my dog's life by hoping that some goofy hippy remedy will work when I KNOW that the rabies vaccine will.

I understand and generally agree with the criticisms of over-vaccination. However, this isn't kennel cough. This particular bug makes your dog dead.


Thats just it. There are some risks or possible risks for vaccination, but I KNOW my dog will die for Rabies, Distemper, Parvo, etc - I guess I just don't understand the reasoning behind not vaccinating for at least the diseases that are always or almost always fatal.

not trying to argue but agreeing with your points Demo and elaborating a bit on my own...
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Postby maberi » October 14th, 2009, 3:55 pm

I'm not against vaccinating my dogs for Distemper or Parvo if their titer levels are low and do vaccinate my guys for rabies when I need to.

Have the companies who put out the vacs always packaged them with multiple vaccines or is this something new?

For instance, Kayden's Distemper levels are low/medium but his Parvo titer numbers are through the roof. Now normally if I walk in the door and don't speak up they give him a vaccination that includes Distemper, Hepatitis, Leptospirosis, Parainfluenza, and Parvo

I requested they try to find a distemper only vaccination and after 2 weeks they were able to find one with Distemper and Parainfluenza

I don't have a problem vaccinating my dogs against something their body needs. But pumping in excess amounts of something they don't need makes zero sense to me. I also don't like the idea of overloading a dogs immune system with rabies on top of a 5 in 1 at just one visit.
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Postby Malli » October 14th, 2009, 4:09 pm

I've no idea if they've always bundled them or not, or if it may tie into if the diseases are at some level related.

It would be nice if they could be given seperately, but it also may be more expensive because it was more (concievably) injections... :|
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Postby maberi » October 14th, 2009, 4:50 pm

Malli wrote:I've no idea if they've always bundled them or not, or if it may tie into if the diseases are at some level related.

It would be nice if they could be given seperately, but it also may be more expensive because it was more (concievably) injections... :|


And it is indeed more

I for one would space the vaccinations out so you not only get dinged for the separate vaccinations, but the office visits as well
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Postby Malli » October 14th, 2009, 5:41 pm

did I read that wrong?
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Postby call2arms » October 14th, 2009, 8:31 pm

Not only it is important to get the rabies vaccination for your dog, and yourself, but also, in the case that a dog contracts it - what if it bites other animals? That's just plain contributing to the spread of a deadly disease. The bigger picture here, is that vaccinating your own dog (or making sure he has sufficient antibodies to fight it) is just being responsible as a member of society in general.
There's little chances of a dog contracting rabies, but we've seen a few bats found in attics/houses that were positive, so you never know!


Has anyone encountered a dog/animal/person who was bitten by a positive animal? Any symptoms, different, mild, none?
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Postby kera09 » October 14th, 2009, 8:38 pm

well i guess everyone has me thinking a bit harder about this now. Correct me if im wrong (which i may be) but isnt there more vaccinations in the actual rabies shot? i think i may have asked before but that may have been parvo. I just feel like we dont vaccinate ourselves every yr why should we have to do it to our dogs? Also how does everyone feel about the 1 yr and 3yr rabies? And with all the cases of the dogs getting cancer right at the injection site scares me. :( bottom line is im going to have to do it for at least lulu to get her into some classes.
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Postby katiek0417 » October 14th, 2009, 8:53 pm

I didn't open this thread all day b/c I didn't actually think someone was questioning whether to give the rabies vaccine or not.

We get our males titered....I admit that our females do get vaccines regularly...but that is b/c of whelping and nursing puppies...

That being said, many of you know what I went through with Dru this summer...her immune system was severely compromised. She will be getting spayed next week....she is back on amikacin to prepare her...my vet told me that we need to start titering her and avoid vaccinations at all costs b/c of her compromised immune system...but WE WILL NOT AVOID the rabies shot...she will still get that every 3 years (as stated by law for the state of MD).

And even if he said otherwise, there is no way I wouldn't get a vaccine that could prevent something deadly in my dog....

well i guess everyone has me thinking a bit harder about this now. Correct me if im wrong (which i may be) but isnt there more vaccinations in the actual rabies shot? i think i may have asked before but that may have been parvo. I just feel like we dont vaccinate ourselves every yr why should we have to do it to our dogs? Also how does everyone feel about the 1 yr and 3yr rabies? And with all the cases of the dogs getting cancer right at the injection site scares me. :( bottom line is im going to have to do it for at least lulu to get her into some classes.


Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but rabies is the only vaccine in that shot. Are you thinking of DHPP (distemper, hepatitis, parvo, parainfluenza)?

You should do what your state requires you to do. Some states (again, someone please correct me if I'm wrong) require the vaccine every year...some states say every 3 is sufficient.
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Postby Marinepits » October 14th, 2009, 9:02 pm

The rabies vaccine is not a combination vaccine. It's just for rabies.

As far as vaccine-related cancers, here's an article you may want to look at:

http://marvistavet.com/html/body_vaccin ... arcom.html
Dogs are so rarely affected by this phenomenon that is considered of no realistic significance. Vaccine-induced fibrosarcomas seem to be a feline problem only.


And your vet can tell you what is best for your dog as far as the one year or three year vaccine. The vets I've worked for generally give the first rabies vaccine as a one year, then each subsequent vaccine would be every three years -- as long as the dog remains healthy.

Most states leave it up to the veterinarian as to whether your pet gets the one or three year vaccine -- the states generally don't care as long as the pet gets the vaccine and is kept current.
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Postby katiek0417 » October 14th, 2009, 9:08 pm

Marinepits wrote:
Most states leave it up to the veterinarian as to whether your pet gets the one or three year vaccine -- the states generally don't care as long as the pet gets the vaccine and is kept current.


Thank you! I was always told that MD requires the 3-year...
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Postby Marinepits » October 14th, 2009, 9:11 pm

Again, it's "most states" and "generally" -- there are always exceptions. Contact your local Animal Control for exact rules in your own state.
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Postby madremissy » October 14th, 2009, 9:16 pm

Some people here know I was questioning Kinzyl and Sammy's yearly shots when they went in August. I never thought anything about it until Yoda. :(
I started asking questions and researching then. I had a hard time understanding but some people told me the right questions to ask my vet and I did.
They had their 3 year rabies last year so that was not needed. I asked about the yearly of the combo shot and if they would ever go to a three year. My vet told me that "they" whoever they are, ( I am thinking the board of vets in Georgia :| ) were researching the benefits to every three year.
I was not so concerned about Kinzyl as I was for Sammy. He is now 7 and as I understood it the older they got the less they needed certain vaccines.
This is something that I am really concerned about but at the same time confuses me to no end. I have a hard time understanding all the medical talk. :oops: I might still be confused in my explanation so this thread is important to me.
As for the rabies shot, I would not go without that for any of my animals. We live in the country with many wild animals so that is a no brainer. I think even if we lived in the city it would be a no brainer for me.
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Postby Marinepits » October 14th, 2009, 9:31 pm

Missy, if it helps, Dr Blabs only does my crew's vaccines every three years -- that is for ALL the vaccines, including rabies.

Because Katy is over 15 years old now, she's not getting anything else except rabies and that's only if she outlives her current vaccine. Indy is nine now, so he's borderline on needing any more vaccines, especially considering he had cancer recently.

If you're really concerned about Gotty, ask you vet to do titers before he gets his next vaccines. The titer measures Gotty's blood levels to see if he is still protected by his last vaccines. If he's still protected, you won't need to get more vaccines for him. BUT, you do need to test him every six months to a year or so to make sure he's still protected. Not all vets do titers but it doesn't hurt to ask.

I don't know of any state who will accept a rabies titer in lieu of the actual vaccine UNLESS there is a veterinarian waiver excusing your dog from the rabies vaccine. You'd have to call your STATE Veterinarian's Office for their laws and rules.
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Postby maberi » October 14th, 2009, 9:32 pm

For anyone looking for more info our vaccination guidelines I highly suggest reading the guidelines posted by AAHA (American Animal Hospital Association)

http://secure.aahanet.org/eweb/dynamicp ... Guidelines

Demo turned me onto it a while back in another thread. It has a lot of good information (easily digested for the every day pet owner) and is what many vet offices are now following. Although my vet follows these guidelines, their sales practices don't always go hand in hand.
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Postby katiek0417 » October 14th, 2009, 9:39 pm

Thanks, Matt!
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Postby maberi » October 14th, 2009, 9:40 pm

Hopefully this isn't going off topic but are some vets still suggesting yearly boosters for core vaccinations outside of rabies?
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Postby katiek0417 » October 14th, 2009, 9:48 pm

maberi wrote:Hopefully this isn't going off topic but are some vets still suggesting yearly boosters for core vaccinations outside of rabies?


I have clients who have told me their vets recommend it...

Mine recommends it for the females that are breeding...and if we don't plan on breeding in a given year, to skip it that year...but they should get it prior to breeding...
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