canine 'disarming' - WTF?

Postby HappyPuppy » July 29th, 2009, 3:02 pm

(= removing aggressive dog's teeth so it won't continue to bite people. I think I'd euth a dog that was that HA !!!)

http://www.care2.com/causes/animal-welf ... disarming/

The Los Angeles Times ran an intriguing story last week about a six-year-old American Eskimo dog named Cotton who had undergone the controversial medical procedure - Canine Disarming. The surgery was initiated by the dog’s owner, Diane R. Krieger as a last ditch effort to stop her beloved pet from viciously biting anyone who came onto her property.

The story posed an interesting question for all pet owners. "What would you do if you had a highly aggressive dog?"

According to Krieger, her 35-pound dog is so severely aggressive that no medication or technique has remedied the problem, including assistance from the Dog Whisperer, Cesar Millan. Krieger has tried therapies such as herbal supplements to alter her dog’s mood, desensitization training, a low-protein diet and a dog-aggression expert.

“I tried clicker training, high-pitched electronic tones, pepper spray, throwing soda cans filled with rocks. I considered an electric shock collar, but worried that in the hands of an amateur…it might do more harm than good,” said Krieger.

Krieger was running out of options and considering euthanasia when she saw Dr. David Nielsen, a veterinary dentist being interviewed on Animal Planet. He was discussing a permanent cure to aggression and biting called – canine disarming.

Krieger signed Cotton up for the procedure and the L.A. Times followed him through the surgery.

While canine disarming is not new and in fact dates back to Native American Indians, Dr. Nielsen has created his own technique for the procedure that promotes less pain for the dog and quicker healing. He uses a laser to cut away 4 millimeters off each of the dog’s four canine teeth; then he smoothes over the ends of each tooth with the laser. The same procedure is also done to the dog’s extra set of pointy incisors.

The dog must then have follow-up care at 3, 6 and 9 months to be sure the roots of the teeth do not die off. If that happens, a root canal must be performed.

The procedure is considered highly controversial by the American Veterinary Medical Association. Dr. Gail Golab, from the AVMA reported that the organization is opposed to disarming for aggression because it doesn’t address the underlying cause of the problem. She believes owners may become lax about protecting their dog from people after the surgery.

On the other hand, the American Veterinary Dental College adopted a position statement in 2005 endorsing the procedure in “selected cases.”

Even Dr. Nielsen believes canine disarming is controversial. On his website he states, “This procedure is performed on dogs that have bitten people after all forms of behavioral treatment and training have been exhausted.”

The site further states, “It has been said by notable dog trainers that once a dog has crossed the line and bitten fiercely, that we cannot expect them to be trained otherwise; hence the need for disarming, which is preferable to euthanasia.”

Cotton’s case poses some intriguing moral questions:
1. Is Diane Krieger the ultimate pet owner because she was willing to go to extreme lengths to save her dog?
2. Is she acting in the best interests of her pet?
3. Will the end justify the means if Cotton stops biting?

Advocates of canine disarming say it works because the dog realizes that it can’t use its teeth to harm anyone, so it becomes more submissive.

Apparently Cotton hasn’t heard this bit of information, yet. Since the surgery he still runs after people, especially men, who enter the property. He has chased after a gardener who offered Cotton his boot to gnaw on and a handyman who let the dog chew on a wooden handrail. In each case, Cotton hasn’t been able to do any physical harm to the workers. It will be interesting to see if the advocates are right and if Cotton loses interest in attacking people in the future.


quick pollvote now! thanks for voting! .Would you choose Canine Disarming for your aggressive dog?

no! leaning no leaning yes yes!
45% no! 10% leaning no 31% leaning yes 15% yes!.
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Postby Malli » July 29th, 2009, 3:15 pm

yeah, WTF.
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Postby amazincc » July 29th, 2009, 3:18 pm

HappyPuppy wrote:
According to Krieger, her 35-pound dog is so severely aggressive that no medication or technique has remedied the problem, including assistance from the Dog Whisperer, Cesar Millan.

I can see where the dog would get REALLY pissed at people after that. :rolleyes2: lol

He was discussing a permanent cure to aggression and biting called – canine disarming.

Permanent "cure", my ass. But what an ingenious money-making opportunity. Gotta give him credit for coming up w/something like that, and giving it such a charming name to boot. :neutral:



WTF is WRONG w/this woman??? If she KNOWS the dog is aggressive... why not keep him securely confined??? Or at least muzzled???
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Postby HappyPuppy » July 29th, 2009, 3:30 pm

oooooooooooooopssssss - wrong forum - Mods couldya please move this to Off Topic?

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Postby pitbullmamaliz » July 29th, 2009, 4:02 pm

amazincc wrote:WTF is WRONG w/this woman??? If she KNOWS the dog is aggressive... why not keep him securely confined??? Or at least muzzled???


That's exactly what I was thinking. Much cheaper. Much more humane. :|
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Postby LMM » July 29th, 2009, 4:17 pm

Wow. Just wow :neutral:
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Postby mnp13 » July 29th, 2009, 4:43 pm

That's just stupid.

An aggressive dog isn't magically going to not be aggressive because you ruin their teeth. They are still going to do all the same stuff, but not necessarily as effectively.

Jue - Katrina's fiance's dog doesn't have any canines at all - but still does bitework, including long sends and still holds on to the decoy without problems.
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Postby amazincc » July 29th, 2009, 5:21 pm

Gawd... imagine if this catches on??? Tons of undisciplined, untrained, toothless dogs are gonna run the country... :shock: :crazy2:

Because, you know... why BOTHER teaching them anything if you can remove their teeth??? :| :rolleyes2:
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Postby katiek0417 » July 29th, 2009, 5:39 pm

mnp13 wrote:That's just stupid.

An aggressive dog isn't magically going to not be aggressive because you ruin their teeth. They are still going to do all the same stuff, but not necessarily as effectively.

Jue - Katrina's fiance's dog doesn't have any canines at all - but still does bitework, including long sends and still holds on to the decoy without problems.


lol I was reading that article, and thinking I totallly need to post about Jue! You beat me to it...

I'll try to take a pic of Jue's mouth and post it...but he literally has NO teeth (even his molars are pretty shot)...

He still does bitework, and rather effectively, I might add - I plan on showing him at regionals...oh, and making them more submissive:

Advocates of canine disarming say it works because the dog realizes that it can’t use its teeth to harm anyone, so it becomes more submissive.


Okay, b/c Jue has become real submissive! Handler sensitive - he's always been (regardless of teeth or not)...submissive, no...

OH AND, do they realize that many bites don't occur as a result of dominance...gosh, I could go on all day about this!!!!
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Postby Malli » July 30th, 2009, 3:06 am

the more I see problem behaviors, the more I believe aggression is common in any breed, if a dog is given (intentionally or not)the option to handle a distasteful or uncomfortable situation, or to not handle it.

We had a Chihuahua at work a long time ago missing all or most of his teeth, the dog was aggressive, I was outside with him and wen't to pick him up and felt an odd sensation, then realised the dog was biting me. It didn't hurt, but I was none-the-less still not impressed, the dog still had the same intention. Its just like the whole small dog big dog thing with aggressive behaviors, just because the dog doesn't do as much damage, doesn't mean the intention wasn't any less severe :|
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Postby plebayo » July 31st, 2009, 12:33 am

Ahaha this brings back memories!

So when I first started working at the clinic I work at we had a black mini poodle named Pepe. He was about 17 when I started working at the clinic. His owners brought him in like once a year to get groomed. The dog was EVIL. He was so bad they had all of his teeth removed [at another clinic] he still had his parts and was horrible. The groomer could barely get through the groom, someone had to squish his face to get a muzzle on him but we couldn't sedate him because he was so old and had a wicked heart murmur [which I think sedation would be better than stress but whatever...] one time he got loose and a tech caught him. She just grabbed him but even without teeth he could pinch really hard.

I've always felt if a dog feels so threatened it wants to kill everything it would be better off being euthed and coming back as something better. It's not fair to the dog for them to have to live in the defense all the time, that isn't a good life to me.
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