Heartworm Question

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Postby Sariss » April 9th, 2006, 9:54 am

With Interceptor, depending on how bad the infection of Heartworm is, it can be fatal. Our Vet used to make it optional to get a titre done at the beginning of season, until one of the dogs ended up being Heartworm positive and was given Interceptor. He didn't die thankfully, but he was VERY close.

I'm pretty sure Interceptor and Sentinel are the only Heartworm preventatives that aren't FDA aprooved on Heartworm Positive dogs. We do not require a blood test for Revolution or Heartgard.
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Postby odnarb » April 9th, 2006, 2:41 pm

SisMorphine wrote:Not sure how it is in other states but:

A 1 year vaccine vs. a 3 year vaccine in MA = SAME VACCINE!

They come from the same trays, the same bottles. They do not say "good for 1 year, good for 3 years" they are the same exact vaccine.



I'm not talking about Rabies, I'm talking about the other core vaccines, Distemper-Adenovirus-Parvo. There are only a couple of these vaccines licensed for three year use, and neither of them are OTC.


Think about when humans get vaccinated, do we do it every single year? Nope. Do we even do it every 3 years? Nope. Just when we're little, which is when our immune system is easily compromised.



I get vaccinated more often than that, because I am high risk, as do a lot of adults.
Last edited by odnarb on April 9th, 2006, 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby odnarb » April 9th, 2006, 2:45 pm

Sariss wrote:With Interceptor, depending on how bad the infection of Heartworm is, it can be fatal. Our Vet used to make it optional to get a titre done at the beginning of season, until one of the dogs ended up being Heartworm positive and was given Interceptor. He didn't die thankfully, but he was VERY close.

I'm pretty sure Interceptor and Sentinel are the only Heartworm preventatives that aren't FDA aprooved on Heartworm Positive dogs. We do not require a blood test for Revolution or Heartgard.



The problem is the anaphylaxis to the dying worms, which is a VERY common side effect. Even Heartgard and Revolution can cause that. If a veterinarian prescribes that to a HW+ dog and they die, that veterinarian is liable.
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Postby SisMorphine » April 9th, 2006, 4:01 pm

odnarb wrote:
SisMorphine wrote:Not sure how it is in other states but:

A 1 year vaccine vs. a 3 year vaccine in MA = SAME VACCINE!

They come from the same trays, the same bottles. They do not say "good for 1 year, good for 3 years" they are the same exact vaccine.



I'm not talking about Rabies, I'm talking about the other core vaccines, Distemper-Adenovirus-Parvo. There are only a couple of these vaccines licensed for three year use, and neither of them are OTC.

I just used rabies as an example. The DA2P vax that we use (and also the FVRCP vax for cats) it all the same also. Has been in each hospital I've worked in.
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Postby SisMorphine » April 9th, 2006, 4:03 pm

odnarb wrote:I get vaccinated more often than that, because I am high risk, as do a lot of adults.

Other than the flu vaccine what do you get vaccinated for? I have never heard of adult vaccinations other than the flu (or tetnis/rabies when applicable). But the general vaccinations given as children are not continued throughout adulthood.
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Postby mnp13 » April 9th, 2006, 4:16 pm

katiek0417 wrote:Oops...sorry...apparently your PM notice went into my junk mail folder (as does everything from pit bull talk)...I just checked my messages, and there you were (and there was a message in my junk email folder).


If you add '@pitbulltalk.com' to your safe list they won't go there anymore!
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Postby mnp13 » April 9th, 2006, 4:23 pm

SisMorphine wrote:But we are over-vaccinating ourselves and our animals in general. There are studies out there linking the incidence of ADD and ADHD in kids to over-vaccination,


and don't forget Autism, and a couple of cancers.
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Postby Magnolia618 » April 9th, 2006, 6:09 pm

I have never ever been vaccinated except for tetanus a few years ago. My animals (except for Trey) havent been vaccinated for anything other than rabies in the past few years.

I have them tested for h/w-lyme combo for $10 at the shelter every year. :| I dont give the heartworm preventative in the winter because I dont think it is neccesary.
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Postby SisMorphine » April 9th, 2006, 6:26 pm

mnp13 wrote:
SisMorphine wrote:But we are over-vaccinating ourselves and our animals in general. There are studies out there linking the incidence of ADD and ADHD in kids to over-vaccination,


and don't forget Autism, and a couple of cancers.

I haven't read those yet but will DEFINITELY look into that. It all makes sense . . .
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Postby katiek0417 » April 9th, 2006, 7:33 pm

odnarb wrote:Actually, the same goes for heartworm preventative and Advantage & Frontline, as well.


As an FYI, I spoke with my vet at length about his policy, and he specifically said that while Interceptor, Haartguard were controlled...flea medicines such as Advantage and Frontline were not.

You don't need a prescription for those (you used to)...meaning that really, any seller or buyer can get a hold of it....
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Postby SisMorphine » April 9th, 2006, 7:34 pm

katiek0417 wrote:
odnarb wrote:Actually, the same goes for heartworm preventative and Advantage & Frontline, as well.


As an FYI, I spoke with my vet at length about his policy, and he specifically said that while Interceptor, Haartguard were controlled...flea medicines such as Advantage and Frontline were not.

You don't need a prescription for those (you used to)...meaning that really, any seller or buyer can get a hold of it....

That is true. It just recently changed.
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Postby katiek0417 » April 9th, 2006, 7:35 pm

SisMorphine wrote:But we are over-vaccinating ourselves and our animals in general. There are studies out there linking the incidence of ADD and ADHD in kids to over-vaccination, imagine what over-vaccination is doing to our animals? I truly believe that as a society we would have a much healthier bunch of animals if they were vaccinated less (in addition to being fed correctly of course).


Keep in mind that there is also a MAJOR genetic link with ADD/ADHD. There's a ton of literature about that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of over-vaccinating....but let's not blame everything on it.
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Postby SisMorphine » April 9th, 2006, 7:43 pm

katiek0417 wrote:
SisMorphine wrote:But we are over-vaccinating ourselves and our animals in general. There are studies out there linking the incidence of ADD and ADHD in kids to over-vaccination, imagine what over-vaccination is doing to our animals? I truly believe that as a society we would have a much healthier bunch of animals if they were vaccinated less (in addition to being fed correctly of course).


Keep in mind that there is also a MAJOR genetic link with ADD/ADHD. There's a ton of literature about that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of over-vaccinating....but let's not blame everything on it.

Of course there's a huge genetic link also. But there are more and more ADD/ADHD cases showing up that have no genetic links. These are the ones that are being connected to over-vaccination.
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Postby dogcrazyjen » April 9th, 2006, 9:32 pm

ADD/ADHD are also thought to be caused by sedentary lifestyles, and overeating processed foods. There was a principle who decided to run an expiriment, he had all his ADHD kids come in early and ran them for an hour. He then ran them at lunch and after school. At the end of 6 months not one child was on medication.

ADHD in the vast majority of cases is the criminalization of male traits(over 80% of ADHD cases are boys)-rambunctiousnmess, kinetic learning styles, the need for physical contact through play, the need for exercise and the inability to sit for long periods of time on repetitive tasks. The whole link to vaccines is just trying to mask the fact that when 95% of the teachers are women, and the last 20 years has been spent feminizing the classrooms to save the girls, and cutting of sports, recess, and the ability to even run on the playground, there is a huge negative of creating a very male hostile environment. And whammo, all of a sudden boys are being diagnosed with this problem and medicated into submission.

Don't get me started on this. I know that there are a few kids with real ADHD, but I have never met one-and I have met a lot of kids on Ritalin. Funny, there is serious proof that Ritalin causes long term depression and increased suicide rates, but we still are medicating kids with it.


OK, off my soap box :evil:
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Postby cheekymunkee » April 9th, 2006, 9:58 pm

I know that there are a few kids with real ADHD, but I have never met one-and I have met a lot of kids on Ritalin.


I have, my nephew. HOLY crap that kid was a tornado ON ritalin & wsa uncontrollable off of it. He was a very troubled kid & could go from being the most loveable child imaginable to a raging lunatic in a matter of moments. I was one of the ONLY adults that could deal with him & control him when he lost control. I lost him to an accidental self-inflicted gun shot wound a few years ago and as much as he drove me nuts I miss him every day.
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Postby concreterose » April 9th, 2006, 10:36 pm

dogcrazyjen wrote:I will probably get the business, but I do not give my dogs heartworm meds nor do I get them tested, unless I am going down south with them. In our county there are about 10-15 cases a year, out of hundreds of thousands of dogs. It just is not worth the five hundred dollars or so a year I would pay for tests and frontline. Also, I do not believe in medicating my dogs unless they are sick. Now that I have said this, I will probably get struck down with heartworms :shock:


You should really get them tested every six months if you don't give the preventative.
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Postby katiek0417 » April 9th, 2006, 10:36 pm

dogcrazyjen wrote:ADD/ADHD are also thought to be caused by sedentary lifestyles, and overeating processed foods. There was a principle who decided to run an expiriment, he had all his ADHD kids come in early and ran them for an hour. He then ran them at lunch and after school. At the end of 6 months not one child was on medication.

ADHD in the vast majority of cases is the criminalization of male traits(over 80% of ADHD cases are boys)-rambunctiousnmess, kinetic learning styles, the need for physical contact through play, the need for exercise and the inability to sit for long periods of time on repetitive tasks. The whole link to vaccines is just trying to mask the fact that when 95% of the teachers are women, and the last 20 years has been spent feminizing the classrooms to save the girls, and cutting of sports, recess, and the ability to even run on the playground, there is a huge negative of creating a very male hostile environment. And whammo, all of a sudden boys are being diagnosed with this problem and medicated into submission.

Don't get me started on this. I know that there are a few kids with real ADHD, but I have never met one-and I have met a lot of kids on Ritalin. Funny, there is serious proof that Ritalin causes long term depression and increased suicide rates, but we still are medicating kids with it.


OK, off my soap box :evil:


Let's not turn this board into a discussion about problems in humans..

But HOW do you explain the existence of executive function problems in BOTH children and adults with ADHD? No amount of running in the world will fix that...if it did, we would be putting every person who ever had a neurological disorder, CVA, TBI on a treadmill.
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Postby mnp13 » April 9th, 2006, 10:58 pm

1. I have ADD, I'm 31 and was diagnosed long before it was the "in" thing.

2. Go ahead and continue this discussion - in the OT section.

thank you.
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