Getting in to Protection Sports?

Weight pull, Protection, Agility, Flyball... you name it!

Postby furever_pit » June 14th, 2008, 11:08 am

I'm interested in getting Dylan started in PP training. I'm having some trouble getting started though. :oops:

The main reason I think Dylan would be good at PP is because he is so incredibly prey driven. What other characteristics should I be looking for for this kind of work?

Also, how do I find a good club to start training? The only one that I have found in my area just doesn't seem like the best place. I've stopped by numerous times to see the facilities and I've never seen anyone else there. You can see the training field from the highway and no one that I have ever talked to have seen any dogs out there. It's also an insanely expensive facility....like $1600 for a 6 week course. I definitely don't have the money for that. The owner, and trainer, also suggested that I leave Dylan in an unsupervised "doggie daycare" with his two GSD pups. He kept on about it even after I told him that Dylan is reactive and does not appreciate puppy play antics. Is there some kind of registry for PP trainers?

I appreciate any and all suggestions and insight about PP in general. I'm still learning. :dance:
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Postby amazincc » June 14th, 2008, 11:13 am

Where in FL are you again?

There is TONS of info at this site - http://www.uwsp.edu/PSYCH/dog/Protect.htm
Last edited by amazincc on June 14th, 2008, 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby furever_pit » June 14th, 2008, 11:25 am

Stuart, it's right outside of West Palm Beach and Jupiter.

I would be willing to drive 2 or 3 hours to get to a really quality facility; unfortunately, I don't think that will be very possible with my work schedule. I need to find something that meets either on Thursdays, or in the middle of the day on the weekend. I could do late nights too I guess.

I think I'd also like to work with someone who is experienced with bulldog breeds. Dylan is just so totally bulldog in his stubbornness and definitely has a dominant streak.
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Postby amazincc » June 14th, 2008, 11:26 am

Oops... I edited my post while you were typing. lol

The site I posted has all kinds of good info.
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Postby amazincc » June 14th, 2008, 11:28 am

This one might be a good start for you - http://www.workbulldog.com/




Well... you aren't that far from me, and we got NOTHING where I live. Katrina might be able to give you some info though... she deals w/PP work.
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Postby SisMorphine » June 14th, 2008, 11:47 am

Good luck finding a good bitework trainer. And finding a good bitework trainer who is experienced in working bully breeds is even a more difficult find.

There is a big difference between training a dog for sport work, and training one who will bite for real. So YOU need to decide what you want to do first before taking the next step of finding a trainer.
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Postby furever_pit » June 14th, 2008, 12:21 pm

SisMorphine wrote:There is a big difference between training a dog for sport work, and training one who will bite for real. So YOU need to decide what you want to do first before taking the next step of finding a trainer.


I'm much more interested in the opportunity to train and work with Dylan and utilizing his drive than I am in whether or not he would attack off the training field. Sure, it would be nice if he I could trust him to use a warning bark or to defend me close range in the real world but I would NEVER want him to chase down someone off of the training field. In my mind, that is way way way to easy for the media to turn against my boy and all pit bulls in general. I would also like the opportunity to compete with Dylan in this work.

I guess that would be sport work, then??
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Postby katiek0417 » June 14th, 2008, 3:00 pm

Please understand...Cy is an incredible sport dog...but in the real world I know he'll also protect me...PP dogs don't simply chase people down...its all an extension of obedience, really...the bite command is an obedience command...however, you also need strong obedience to be able to call your dog off of a bite...

If you're just looking to have fun with your dog, then I'd concentrate on sport work, especially given his prey drive...

Keep in mind, however, that even with prey drive, it's not always easy to transition the dog to actually biting a person...You can try to channel the drives, though, and a very skilled trainer will be able to do that with any breed...

Let me ask you this: did you ever correct (or do you ever) correct your dog for being nippy?

I'm not sure how far this is from you, but they are a PSA club:

Good Fella's
Mirmar FL
Contact: Mark Muscella
954-554-6545
k9protection@bellsouth.net

Mondioring:
Spirit Working Dog Club
Plant City, FL
Carrie Silva
813-707-1293
info@thedoghousellc.com

French Ring/Ringsport (I've heard good things about this guy):
Richard Bonilla
7568 Coconut Blvd
Royal Palm Beach, FL 33412
(561) 436-9875, (561) 333-4990
powerwagger1@msn.com
http://apacheringclub.com/

Also, I'm not sure if this guy has a club, but I met him at a PSA trial...really nice guy, crossed over to PSA from French Ring (he's actually a board member for NARA):
Frank Cowan
k9barrage@aol.com

You can tell Frank that Greg and Katrina from MD referred you...
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

Katrina
Sacha CGC - Dumb Lab
Nisha CGC, PDC, PSA TC, PSA 1 - Crazy Malinois
Drusilla SLUT- Pet
Nemo - Dual-Purpose Narcotics
Cy TC, PSA 1, PSA 2, 2009 PSA Level 3 National Champion
Axo - Psycho Puppy
Rocky - RIP My Baby Boy
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Postby furever_pit » June 14th, 2008, 3:42 pm

Well, I didn't have Dylan as a puppy so I don't know whether or not he was corrected during his nippy stage. He is typically not mouthy with me. He will nip at other people if he feels threatened.

I do encourage him to bite tugs and his flirtpole. When he has a mouthful he is rewarded with the toy for a minute.

Are there any PP competitions? And is a PSA club a PP facility?

Thanks for your help.
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Postby katiek0417 » June 14th, 2008, 3:54 pm

furever_pit wrote:Well, I didn't have Dylan as a puppy so I don't know whether or not he was corrected during his nippy stage. He is typically not mouthy with me. He will nip at other people if he feels threatened.

I do encourage him to bite tugs and his flirtpole. When he has a mouthful he is rewarded with the toy for a minute.

Are there any PP competitions? And is a PSA club a PP facility?

Thanks for your help.


PSA is Protection Sports Association...

PP and Sport are usually very different things...many sport dogs will not bite in real life...PP dogs are trained for personal protection...more tight obedience is necessary in sport....though any dog that has been trained to bite should have good obedience, IMO...

Keep in mind that working a dog yourself can do more harm than good....no training is better than bad training! It's okay to work his prey using the tug and flirt pole...but having a mouthful is nothing..grips should be worked, etc...he should be worked on a back-tie at first...and we never recommend that the owner do this bite building with the dog until the dog is far advanced...

One of the hardest thing to do is take a dog that was corrected for nipping and then trying to get them to bite later on...Why? Because now there is a conflict between what they were once corrected for and what you want them to do...that's why I asked...
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

Katrina
Sacha CGC - Dumb Lab
Nisha CGC, PDC, PSA TC, PSA 1 - Crazy Malinois
Drusilla SLUT- Pet
Nemo - Dual-Purpose Narcotics
Cy TC, PSA 1, PSA 2, 2009 PSA Level 3 National Champion
Axo - Psycho Puppy
Rocky - RIP My Baby Boy
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Postby furever_pit » June 14th, 2008, 6:45 pm

Well then PSA is what I'm interested in. I don't know that I have the general training experience to go for Schutzhund or any of the Ring sports....maybe one day. :D

So should I stop playing tug with my boy until I join a club and am shown how to do it correctly? I guess I wouldn't have a problem with that but other than the tugs and the flirtpole that aren't many ways that I can work his prey drive (no fenced in areas means no fetch).

I really appreciate all the info y'all. Looks like I have a lot more research to do before I get started. LOL.
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Postby katiek0417 » June 14th, 2008, 6:50 pm

furever_pit wrote:Well then PSA is what I'm interested in. I don't know that I have the general training experience to go for Schutzhund or any of the Ring sports....maybe one day. :D

So should I stop playing tug with my boy until I join a club and am shown how to do it correctly? I guess I wouldn't have a problem with that but other than the tugs and the flirtpole that aren't many ways that I can work his prey drive (no fenced in areas means no fetch).

I really appreciate all the info y'all. Looks like I have a lot more research to do before I get started. LOL.


Ring isn't all the different than PSA...it's still a surprise-based scenario sport...

I would stop playing tug...and really only allow the trained decoys to do it at the training facility...you wouldn't believe how easy it is to screw up a dog :D
"Rumor has it, compulsion is evil."

Katrina
Sacha CGC - Dumb Lab
Nisha CGC, PDC, PSA TC, PSA 1 - Crazy Malinois
Drusilla SLUT- Pet
Nemo - Dual-Purpose Narcotics
Cy TC, PSA 1, PSA 2, 2009 PSA Level 3 National Champion
Axo - Psycho Puppy
Rocky - RIP My Baby Boy
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