Big_Ant wrote:If you claim that it's so "RAMPANT" then show us case studies where it shows actual infections of dogs from raw eggs?
Potential for Harm is everywhere. I could slip and fall when I go bleed the lizard in a minute, I could trip getting on the train and break my nose, but until it happens, that's all it is.
- Anthony
msvette2u wrote:You know, I'm not putting this up to get into an argument - far from it - I just wanted people who were unsure of this practice to know that it might NOT be as safe as it seems. In the last post (which you might have missed):
msvette2u wrote:Vaccine 2002 Feb 22;20(11-12):1618-23 Immunogenicity of chi4127 phoP- Salmonella enterica serovar Typhimurium in dogs. McVey DS, Chengappa MM, Mosier DE, Stone GG, Oberst RD, Sylte MJ, Gabbert NM, Kelly-Aehle SM, Curtiss R. "Salmonellae are commonly isolated from dogs. The number of dogs infected with Salmonella spp. is surprisingly high and greater than the incidence of clinical disease would suggest. Salmonellosis is common in greyhound kennels. Morbidity can approach 100% in puppies and the mortality ranges to nearly 40%."
msvette2u wrote:Morbidity means death.
msvette2u wrote:I am not going to go find the studies, but I beleive they were done and are probably correct.
msvette2u wrote:Like I said, if you're willing to assume the risks, then go ahead. I'm not the food police here!
Big_Ant wrote:msvette2u wrote:Vaccine 2002 Feb 22;20(11-12):1618-23 Immunogenicity of chi4127 phoP- Salmonella enterica serovar Typhimurium in dogs. McVey DS, Chengappa MM, Mosier DE, Stone GG, Oberst RD, Sylte MJ, Gabbert NM, Kelly-Aehle SM, Curtiss R. "Salmonellae are commonly isolated from dogs. The number of dogs infected with Salmonella spp. is surprisingly high and greater than the incidence of clinical disease would suggest. Salmonellosis is common in greyhound kennels. Morbidity can approach 100% in puppies and the mortality ranges to nearly 40%."
That means nothing to me unless there are actual details shown. I can spout off statistics all I want, but in order for anyone to believe something, they'd want to see details. Show me studies of kennels. They mention common in greyhound kennels. So show me some greyhound kennel studies? They can't.
The number of dogs infected with Salmonella spp. is surprisingly high and greater than the incidence of clinical disease would suggest.
Raw egg whites contain a protein called avidin, which can deplete your dog of biotin, one of the B vitamins. Biotin is essential to your dog’s growth and coat health. Additionally, raw eggs are often contaminated with bacteria, such as salmonella, and you could end up giving your dog food poisoning in addition to biotin deficiency.
Symptoms of biotin depletion are hair loss, weakness, growth retardation and skeleton deformity. If your dog is suffering from these symptoms the situation is urgent, and veterinary treatment is needed. Cooked eggs are high in protein and make an excellent treat. It is only the raw eggs that should not be given to your dog.
http://mooreshaven.com/pets/dogs/safety ... slist.html
mnp13 wrote:Nothing on the planet is 100% safe. Nothing.
I eat carrots. Someday I will die. Therefore, carrots are deadly.
Just because someone says "there is a 'higher' instance doesn't mean they have anything to back that up."
Romanwild wrote:I love ceaser salad made with raw eggs and extra anchovies. I ain't stopping!
SpiritFngrz wrote:Ok, this review I received: Host adaptation and emergence of infectious disease: the Salmonella paradigm. R.A. Kingsley and A.J. Baumler. Molecular Microbiology. 2000.
is a review of various studies. It mainly focuses on different Salmonella serotypes, and equations/probabilities based on genetics that enables humans, or other hosts to be susceptible to disease (i.e. host adaptation). It mentions a couple Salmonella serotypes in chickens, S. typhi, which causes typhoid fever in humans and higher primates but not in other vertebrates. An example of "host adaptation." The idea of host adaptation is, they think, based on evidence that bacteria such as Salmonella use different virulence genes (genes they use to infect host) to cause infection in different hosts (i.e. human vs. cattle vs. mouse). It could cause local infection, systemic, or no infection at all and the host is just a carrier.
This article did not mention anything specifically about canine infection.
In the last section it did mention S. enteritidis epidemic from poultry, although this was 6 years ago, I do not know if this is still epidemic.
I'll quote it:
"The replacement of the avian-adapted serotype S. gallinarum with the zoonotic S. enteritidis in poultry triggered the epidemic increase in human cases of disease that could be traced back to consumption of raw egg products."
Again, this mentions human epidemic, and this review focuses on host adaptation, or what it takes for humans to be infected with a particular type of Salmonella.
There is no discussion of canine infection or canine host adaptation to any of the Salmonella serotypes discussed.
Based on this I can't conclude, or rather, there is no evidence here, that raw eggs cause Salmonella infection in dogs.
cheekymunkee wrote:Thank you for taking the time to read it & explain it to us. You're so smart it's scary!!
SpiritFngrz wrote:Those of us that are immune competent (healthy, not elderly, not a child) are for the most part able to fight any microbes we come across in our food before they wreak any havoc in our systems.
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