How does you Kibble Rate?? Very interesting Reviews

Food, Fitness and how to keep them healthy.

Postby SpiritFngrz » May 31st, 2006, 2:51 pm

gf turtle wrote:
concreterose wrote:what about soaking high protein kibble in water before feeding...does that help any?
I am going to email the canine nutritionalist that I consult with and ask her about the protein amount in these grainless kibbles.


Humm, interesting question! I'm sure soaking the kibble in water would help. I'd love to know what your nutritionist says about it... and about the use of potatoes and tapioca instead of grains to bind the food.

I soak my dog's kibble meal in warm water for several reasons. She's a spayed female and like many spayed females, she has a tendency to get bladder infections, plus I don't feel she drinks enough water on her own. Mixing her food with water is a way to get more water in her!

Plus I measured the other day and I am only feeding her 1/3 to 1/2 cup of Timberwolf kibble at night. That's not very much and looks pretty puny in the bowl... So by adding water, it swells up and it looks like she's getting a lot more food. She thinks so too...

And it's been proven that kibble that has soaked will not swell in the stomach (since it has already swelled) and thus there is less risk of bloat.

I've also read that it is a myth that dogs eating dry kibble have cleaner teeth. My dog chews raw bones to clean her teeth and she's got very nice white teeth for a 4 1/2 yr old dog.


Yah I put water in the kibble also
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Postby Alaine » June 1st, 2006, 3:54 pm

This is my third time trying to post this so I may give up if this doesn't work :oops: My mom breeds and races Siberian Huskies and I know that she uses a food higher in protein because they are sled dogs. I don't know the exact reason but I think I've read that different dogs need different amounts of protein. I found some interesting things online while I was looking into what kind of food to get Stitch but I don't know how to put them on here. :| My mom tells me that Exceed Lamb & Rice is an excellent food and it's cheaper than most because it is from Sam's Club. I think they also have a Chicken formula. From what I understand I don't want anything that lists corn as the first three ingredients (or even just the first). I'm still new to the dog ownership thing so I'll have to learn from you guys :D http://www.thepetcenter.com/imtop/bestfood.html did that work?
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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 4:49 pm

Your link worked, thanks! I'll go read it...

Yes, I have heard that about racing sled dogs, they burn a huge amount of calories and they can use a food which is higher in protein. I read some info about that a few eyars ago.

But most folks here are feeding pets and even if they are working their dogs, feeding a 42% protein dry food is not a good idea. Most dry kibbles are 22% to 24% protein and that's fine for the average dog.

Raw feeding would be better since it is more natural for a carnivore.

Off to read your link...
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Postby Romanwild » June 1st, 2006, 5:52 pm

42% protein is too much but 100% is good. :?

I know you have an answer for this but it cracked me up anyway. lol

I just purchased my first bag of chicken soup. Can't wait for the liquid poop! yay! :(

While I was at the store I found out that Innova has come out with a red meat formula and California Natural has a new herring and sweet potatoe formula for dogs with allergies and skin problems.
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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 5:58 pm

Romanwild wrote:42% protein is too much but 100% is good. :?

I know you have an answer for this but it cracked me up anyway. lol



Uhmm, are you comparing the 42% protein dry kibble to raw???

If so, raw is 70% water and it is not cooked and processed like kibble is.

So it really is no comparison!
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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 6:01 pm

Romanwild wrote:While I was at the store I found out that Innova has come out with a red meat formula and California Natural has a new herring and sweet potatoe formula for dogs with allergies and skin problems.


Out of curiosity, how much does a bag of EVO cost?

I know it's expensive but I am wondering why one would not try Timberwolf instead if the price is about the same?
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Postby Romanwild » June 1st, 2006, 6:02 pm

gf turtle wrote:
Romanwild wrote:42% protein is too much but 100% is good. :?

I know you have an answer for this but it cracked me up anyway. lol



Uhmm, are you comparing the 42% protein dry kibble to raw???

If so, raw is 70% water and it is not cooked and processed like kibble is.

So it really is no comparison!


Actually I thought you would have had a better answer then that.

Raw is still 100% protein even without the water.
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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 6:34 pm

Romanwild wrote:
gf turtle wrote:
Romanwild wrote:42% protein is too much but 100% is good. :?

I know you have an answer for this but it cracked me up anyway. lol



Uhmm, are you comparing the 42% protein dry kibble to raw???

If so, raw is 70% water and it is not cooked and processed like kibble is.

So it really is no comparison!


Actually I thought you would have had a better answer then that.

Raw is still 100% protein even without the water.


Well, I don't think you're gonna convince me that 42% protein dry food is good and I don't think you will be convinced that feeding 42% dry food is bad. We'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.

I posted a lot of info on the risks of feeding a high protein food yesterday. There were 2 examples of people who fed their dogs EVO with horrible results. The bloodwork done on the 2 dogs after 6 months of eating EVO was enough to get the owner to immediately take them off of EVO. Why would it be worth the risk of damaging your dog's health to feed them EVO? :|


And how much does a bag of EVO cost? I remember looking at it a year ago and it was expensive but I can't remember how much it was.
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Postby Romanwild » June 1st, 2006, 6:52 pm

I not agreeing or disagreeing.

In my mind raw is the best. I obviously haven't tried it yet but it seems I am constantly trying to get my act together. :oops:

In the mean time I use EVO with great results. I haven't had any blood work done but Dreyfus has been on it since it came out and Diamond was on it within 6 months of him. I am now going to switch them but maybe in the future I will have the work done out of curiosity. I have heard of people doing blood work that showed nothing out of the ordinary.

Once again it probably depends on the dog. :|

Incidently, I supplement with whole foods almost daily. meat, dairy, fruits and veggies. Sometimes they get a raw meal when I have a nice peice of venison thawed out! :yum:


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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 6:55 pm

Romanwild wrote:My sense of humor sometimes only amuses me. :oops:


LOL, yeah, it's hard to read a person's "tone" when all you have a written posts! :D
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Postby turtle » June 1st, 2006, 7:01 pm

Romanwild wrote:In the mean time I use EVO with great results. I haven't had any blood work done but Dreyfus has been on it since it came out and Diamond was on it within 6 months of him.


Why not get his blood work done before you change food? That would be a great chance to see how they have done on the food. I hope you consider doing this as it would be very interesting to see how your dogs are really doing on the food.

Yeah, raw is the best. You should try it, it's really not that hard to do. Or even feeding half raw.

I bet they love the venison, mine sure does. We shot an extra deer mostly to use as dog food last season. How was your hunting?
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Postby mnp13 » June 1st, 2006, 7:10 pm

Was anyone able to find my EVO posts on PBF? Do a search for EVO and Ruby and maybe blood.
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Postby Romanwild » June 1st, 2006, 7:41 pm

My plan was to get a few extra white tails for the dogkids but I didn't even go hunting. :( I was going to start them on raw after the first of the year. Oh well, maybe soon.

The last bag of EVO I purchased was a 13lber for $23. Dreyfus had 2 cups a day and Diamond had 1.75 cups. I guess that would be $40-$50 a month for 2 dogs.

I'm not going to do the blood work simply because I can't afford it right now. :|

Until I try raw I will be switching kibbles every month or so.
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Postby babyreba » June 1st, 2006, 8:28 pm

mnp13 wrote:Was anyone able to find my EVO posts on PBF? Do a search for EVO and Ruby and maybe blood.


michelle, i tried searching but didn't come up with a lot . . . just the thread, started by demo, when you first put her on the food and her breath improved and appetite increased. but i couldn't find any updates after that.

one thing i did come across was people mentioning that a big difference between high-protein kibble and raw was that the enzymes in the meat in kibble are killed by the high-temperature cooking process, so the pancreas has to work harder to produce enough enzymes to help the body digest the food.

but it was pointed out several times that there have been no studies proving the concerns about the food to be accurate . . . so it seems pretty inconclusive.

FWIW, my vet and my pet food store owner both told me what others have said: a healthy dog with fully functioning organs should not develop problems as a result of the food; but dogs that have health issues should probably be given something with lower protein to keep issues that exist from being exacerbated. :|

i tried evo for tucker when he was a bit younger, but his poor puppy belly couldn't handle it. too rich or something--he had chronic loose stool for the few weeks he ate it.
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Postby mnp13 » June 1st, 2006, 8:32 pm

Thanks for looking. I remember putting it up, but I think they have 'cleaned house' :|
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Postby Maryellen » June 1st, 2006, 8:46 pm

charles i have jesse on the herring and sweet potato, and she is doing really good on it.. her air allergies are still a pain, but she eats 2 cups of the herring a day.. rufus and sonny are now on canidae and doing better then the herring, they both had wicked breath and gas on the herring, and that all went away with the canidae and brushing teeth more... the herring lasts me 5 weeks, even when all 3 dogs were on it.. the canidae w/ the 2 dogs is lasting the same so far. the herring for a 33 lb i paid $35 and the canidae for a 40 lb i pay $33. the california natural i get a free bag after 12 bags from the place where i get it, so ask whereever you get your food if they have a frequent buyer program like that. i too supplement with meats, veggies, eggs, etc
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Postby turtle » June 2nd, 2006, 1:18 am

mnp13 wrote:Was anyone able to find my EVO posts on PBF? Do a search for EVO and Ruby and maybe blood.


I tried too and could not find it. I'm not the sharpest with computors and all I could find was that thread BabyReba mentioned.
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Postby turtle » June 2nd, 2006, 1:25 am

Romanwild wrote:The last bag of EVO I purchased was a 13lber for $23. Dreyfus had 2 cups a day and Diamond had 1.75 cups. I guess that would be $40-$50 a month for 2 dogs.


Ouch! I think they make EVO in a bigger bag than 13 lbs? But that's a lot to pay for a bag.

You can get a 33 lb bag of TW delivered for about $52, they have free shipping now to make up for them raising the price of the food. That's about the same cost as the EVO.

Too bad you can't do the blood work! And a shame you did not get to go hunting last year.
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Postby Romanwild » June 2nd, 2006, 7:12 am

It' very expensive but the price doesn't really matter to me. If it's for my dog kids. :|
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Postby odnarb » June 3rd, 2006, 1:22 am

For the record, I have a blood panel pending on Harry. It will be interesting to see what it says!

I may go back to TWolf, if the suppliers can convince me that they can stock it better now than when I tried it before. Harry just doens't do food changes well, so I don't want to risk not being able to get his food in a pinch.
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