Penn-hip...someone walk me through this...

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Postby TheRedQueen » December 23rd, 2008, 3:50 pm

I don't know why this confuses me so much :confused: ...can someone help me with these results...

_______'s PennHIP results:

Left = .80

Right = .81

This interpretation is based on 16,969 labs. The medium DI for this group is .46. Results indicate that _____'s hips are tighter than approximately 10% of this group of animals (alternatively, 90% of the group has tighter hips than ______.)


Okay, so what would be good for a lab...what numbers would I want to see? What are the numbers showing exactly? Can someone break this down for a layperson. I've read up on this numerous times, but it just doesn't stick. :doh: I don't really know why. :|

I know this isn't great...right?
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Postby Malli » December 23rd, 2008, 4:05 pm

It seems to me that dog in question is only better hips wise then 10% of the labs they have tested, wich isn't that great (but just my impression, not based on much, really) :|

I would think that you'd want a dog at least the 25-50% mark to do well in an active lifestyle, but thats just my impression and I don't know much(or anything) in the ways of orthopedics :|

anyway, I'm sure there will be more info from other people ;)
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Postby TheRedQueen » December 23rd, 2008, 4:36 pm

Thanks so far Malli,

and here's ,ore info, since I forgot to add it before...

This dog is an Assistance Dog in Training...and would possibly be weight-bearing (stand and brace, bracing while client walks, etc)...and would be very active in terms of lots of walking during the day.

With a large group, such as labs, do the percentages matter as much? Or do you just look at the individual's DI more?
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Postby Karen » December 23rd, 2008, 8:13 pm

the dog is dysplastic and probably wouldn't be a great choice for what you want. I'm sorry :(

under .50/.50 would be ok but the lower the better
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Postby napster » December 23rd, 2008, 8:36 pm

hi,
you always want your ratings for both hips to be under whatever your breeds DI is. keep in mind that as the # of tested individuals per breed increases the DI # will change accordingly - but considering the amount of labs that have been xrayed it probably wont be by much, the numbers you posted in the 80's are poor :( .
i used ph years ago on 2 amstaffs (they were actually the 45th and 51st ones done) and then the median was .56, i believe now its actually .61, which is not a good sign. i'm not sure how many have been done since then - anyone know?
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Postby Leslie H » December 23rd, 2008, 9:58 pm

Pennhip says that dogs w/numbers .70 and higher are very likely to become dysplastic, .30 and below are very unlikely to develop dysplasia. I pay more attention to this than the breed median. You're only supposed to breed dogs that are at the median or below, because then you're breeding to improve. I think if your breed has a lousy median (like apbt's), rather than getting attached to the median, just look at the numbers. Last I heard the apbt median was .57 or .58, I like to see numbers in the .4's and better.
As to .8's, poor dog. I'd wash him from the program. However, remember, Pennhip is just measuring laxity. It may be his hips are well formed, just very loose. some dogs do tighten up, but I wouldn't bank on it.
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Postby TheRedQueen » December 23rd, 2008, 10:37 pm

Thanks everyone...it's much clearer now!

We washed one of his relatives this past year for bad hips too...I feel bad, but also a smidge vindicated, as I was against this breeder for a while...;) I just think we can do better...which is sadly, coming true.
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Postby Hundilein » December 23rd, 2008, 11:38 pm

TheRedQueen wrote:Thanks everyone...it's much clearer now!

We washed one of his relatives this past year for bad hips too...I feel bad, but also a smidge vindicated, as I was against this breeder for a while...;) I just think we can do better...which is sadly, coming true.


I was all worried that this was one of "our" dogs. (Not that we could have known or done anything about it.) I'm glad to hear it's not, and that you feel vindicated, though it sucks that he'll probably have to have a "career change".

I just realized how dumb that thought was on my part, since all of "our" dogs have gone to the prison. D'oh!
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Postby TheRedQueen » December 24th, 2008, 12:26 am

Nah, I would have told you immediately if it was one of "your" dogs. ;) They're all doing well...Moxie comes home this weekend...to finish her training and hopefully get matched this spring. (if not earlier)

This pup was going to replace Moxie at the prison, actually...
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Postby BullyLady » December 24th, 2008, 1:59 am

PennHIP can be so confusing! lol It took me forever and hoooouuuuuuuurs of reading to finally understand. Basically I think of PennHIP like golf, the lower the numbers the better because the number represents a distraction to the hip being in place and you don't want a hip distracted from doing it's job. Now that I write that out it's actually not that clear, maybe it just makes sense in my head...... :oops:
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Postby TheRedQueen » December 24th, 2008, 2:04 am

No, that actually makes sense to me...distracted from doing it's job...I like it! I shall remember that! :mrgreen:
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Postby BritneyP » December 30th, 2008, 9:10 pm

Thanks for this thread! It makes MUCH more sense to me now, too!

On a side note, Erin, can you PM me about PennHip costs in your area? I'm trying to get a generalized idea...

Thanks! :wave2:
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Postby TheRedQueen » December 30th, 2008, 9:12 pm

BritneyP wrote:Thanks for this thread! It makes MUCH more sense to me now, too!

On a side note, Erin, can you PM me about PennHip costs in your area? I'm trying to get a generalized idea...

Thanks! :wave2:


I'll have to check the pup's paperwork...I hardly see it, we get billed...those bills go to the office, not me!

I can tell you that our vet is extremely overpriced...with a 20% discount for Assistance Dogs, it drops our prices to the same level as other vets in the area before discount. :rolleyes2:
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Postby TheRedQueen » February 19th, 2009, 4:45 pm

Alice's hip scores came back...

PennHIP for Alice:

Left - .80

Right - .82

Based on 72,291 animals of all canine breeds. The median DI for this group is .48. Alice is in the 10th percentile. Alice's hips are tighter than 10% of this group; 90% of the group has tighter hips than Alice.

:neutral:
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Postby SisMorphine » February 19th, 2009, 4:48 pm

:( That really sucks.
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Postby BullyLady » February 20th, 2009, 1:29 am

Eeeeek, those are some junky hips.
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