Aggression Poll

[a-bull]

I was just curious about how many of you have DA dogs, and at what age it kicked in.

[pitbullmamaliz]

You know, somebody on here is the thread-killer (I can't remember who???) - well, I'm the "start a heated thread and disappear" person! I've just been sitting back and lurking as Inara is still very dog-friendly. I'm very new to pits, so I enjoy learning and hearing everybody's opinions. On this topic of DA, I honestly don't know what I think about whether it should be bred out. So I lurk and learn!

And think of more topics that could become heated!

[cheekymunkee]

I knew it!!! Trouble should be your middle name.

[Asta]

I am such a threadkiller too!!! Atleast you do it more exciting Liz
Oh and on that scale of DJ then Guinness is a 9...

Cheers,

Asa

[a-bull]

. . . welcome!!

"Muse" is the official thread killer.

There really are so many variables regarding whether your dog will end up being dog aggressive, and there are even different degrees of dog aggression that cover the whole spectrum.

I found the best thing to do is assume your dog will be, plan for it, and don't sweat it. If you're prepared for it and willing to deal with it for the long haul, it won't matter either way.

[cheekymunkee]

lol . . . welcome!!

"Muse" is the official thread killer.

There really are so many variables regarding whether your dog will end up being dog aggressive, and there are even different degrees of dog aggression that cover the whole spectrum.

I found the best thing to do is assume your dog will be, plan for it, and don't sweat it. If you're prepared for it and willing to deal with it for the long haul, it won't matter either way.

[GSDBulldog]

I think I may've killed this thread. . .

[bouvierz]

I forgot a scar!! Justice has one across her nose from tangling with a cat. The cat won.............maybe I should match it.

Common I know your TRYING to be funny but do you think that a litlle nick here and a scar there would make me or anyone compare(or mistake) your dog for a fighting dog Im sorry if some of you disagree or jumped to assumptions from my posts. I was just trying to figure some things out about why some people feel extreme dog aggression shouldnt be dissolved. I know that DA will never be bred out there too many people out there that still like and use the extreme dog aggression (dont assume im talking about any of you).There are others that believe it will change the breed all together ( I cannot predict the future so I have no idea if it would or wouldn't. Cheeky when I mentioned dogs with scars (if you reread my post) I mentioned that I saw them here and on other posts. also I never said those people faught their dogs. Im sure from reading post that there are many rescue dogs. I was wondering are people using them for hogs, weight pulling???do people believe that loosing the extreme dog aggression would change their ability to work? if so why? I know that owning a pit includes the posibility of DA but I would do my best (and have) to deter it. Those of you with DA have you ever worked with a trainer (exp in dog agg) to help deter DA. Im sure it doesnt work on all dogs but ive seen it work on some. I hope I clarified my ????? for you Cheeky Oh and thats funny about the pi$$ thing I was tired last night and couldnt figure out how it kept doing that. I thought I wrote PI$$ but then I saw tinkle and I thought that I must have written tick?????

[mnp13]

Collies are a noisy breed, they bark endlessly. People buy them because they want "Lassie". When they live with them for a while they realize that quiet is a thing of the past. You know what solution the Collie breed clubs have come up with for the problem? Debarking the dogs. They actually support debarking. Maybe they should breed a collie that doesn't bark! It would reduce the number of unwanted collies!

Dog aggression is dog aggression. It's part of the breed. No one here has said that they love it and wish their dogs were extra aggressive. No one has said how wonderful it is to crate-n-rotate.

Dogs that are "jump through a window" dog aggressive are the extreme minority, but they are an easy example because it is the ultimate extreme of what no one in their right minds actually wants.

No person above the level of pond scum breeds to increase dog aggression. Those that do are not worth mentioning.

Responsible breeders breed to better the breed, and not all of them think that includes aiming to reduce/remove dog aggression.

Lab breeders worked on increasing the reterive drive in the dogs, you know what they got? A bunch of OCD, neurotic dogs, but they sure did fetch! You can't pick out a trait and change that one without affecting other parts of the personality

If you want a dog that plays fetch, get a Lab, but deal with owning a big dog that chews things. If you want a dog that tracks, get a Beagle, but deal with the 'doggy smell' and they baying. If you want an all around good-for-everything dog get a Pit Bull, and deal with the dog aggression.

[muse]

You know, somebody on here is the thread-killer (I can't remember who???)

[bouvierz]

Again you just repeated what has already been said. And to be honest with you I cannot remember the last time there was a collie in our shelter. As far as you saying that Pits are good for everything??? I know that I love my dog and he is versatile but if he was DA I wouldnt be able to do the things I like to do. I know that the Pit bulls that are ok with other dogs are good for everything, but im sure DA limits what some dogs are good for. As for getting other breeds to suit my likes and needs I have. I own a Bouvier and a Mastiff. Im sure I will continue to own Pit bulls also, as there are many of them in shelters that need loving homes

[mnp13]

Again you just repeated what has already been said. And to be honest with you I cannot remember the last time there was a collie in our shelter. As far as you saying that Pits are good for everything??? I know that I love my dog and he is versatile but if he was DA I wouldnt be able to do the things I like to do. I know that the Pit bulls that are ok with other dogs are good for everything, but im sure DA limits what some dogs are good for. As for getting other breeds to suit my likes and needs I have. I own a Bouvier and a Mastiff. Im sure I will continue to own Pit bulls also, as there are many of them in shelters that need loving homes

Sure I reapeated it, you don't seem to be listening. there is nothing wrong with dog aggression. It is a breed trait and people who own Pit Bulls need to understand and accept that fact. Every dog owner has the risk of having a dog aggressive dog. Don't want one? Don't get a dog. It's not complicated.

You can NOT select a trait and just "breed it out" without losing something else. It took a few hundred generations to get it there, it's not coming out any time soon.

The collie was an example, substitute juat about any barky herding breed in if you would like. It's the same thing. there are MANY MANY dogs dumped at shelters for barking, breed doesn't matter.

Pits have out performed just about every breed in just about every sport venue they have entered. There is a Pit Bull that out pulls Grizzly. Chris Fraize has been known to train his dog to compete in a specific sport just because someone told him that Pits couldn't compete/excell in it.

Dog aggression may limit some activities with your dog. So what? You just adapt.

[Red]

Very late on this thread so excuse me if I repeat what others already said.Here is a dog who had people questioning what I do with several pit bulls here.The dog is scarred so I must fight him.I guess it is understandable if people wants to judge basing their opinion on his look.It doesn't look that bad to me but then again I have seen badly scarred dogs.





The lil guy comes from Louisiana, right after hurricane Katrina.The shelters released him to a rescue and labelled him an ex fighter.I don't know how they got that information or if it is true.He has scars of face and legs maily.He looks much better now, I had just gotten him when those pics were taken.Either he was a winner or he got into scraps with some other dogs, wondering in the streets or under the owner's care.Scars don't say everything althout they often mean poor care or a freak accident.If you ask me there isn't enough scarred tissues to make me think the dog was matched in several occasions but then again who knows?
Anyway, if this is an ex figher he sure is very well manageable, when it comes to dog aggression.Unlike a male I have here who I can't take chances with, free of scars.The black dog is not out in the streets so his dog aggression is nobody's concern but mine. That is how it works when the breed is cared for by appropriate people.I do not like dog aggression nor look for it but this breed offer more than that so I deal with it.There are different degrees of aggression.The insanely dog aggro dog who would kill a puppy or a non challening dog of the opposite is not that appropriate even within the breed.It is not unknown of famous Ch champions being able to be around other dogs out of the box, if no challenge or triggers are provided.
My point is that dog aggression becomes a problem when dogs aren't managed like they should.A dog aggro rottie or GSD getting out and killing a little fluffy dog is no different than a pit bull doing so.All 3 dogs were failed by their owners and will pay for it.
I can see why many see the aggression as the cause of death of many pit bulls because even in the wrong hands a non aggressive dog is not going to make the headline (apparently nowadays dog to dog attacks are the deal) But then again the breed is what it is and the blame of all problems isn't placed correctly.Would I want to see the dog aggression go bye bye or decrease in intensity and put aside the history for a moment? Not piching a fit if it happens.In a better world a dog should be allowed to show its genetic without much fuss but the reality is that we live in a crappy world where every idiot and their brothers want one of these dogs.That is what kills these dogs..people.Just like people created a breed capable of going trough a two hours fight with no survival instincts and then sold it out to the general public.

Well seeing dogs with scars pisses me off. Twisted Evil If everyone is as responsiable as they claim how do accidents happen? Im asking questions that eveyone talks around but doesnt answer???? Im not insulting anyone Im asking a question

No problem being honest here.Even the best of us makes a mistake and sometime reguardless of the precautions a fight does happen.In years of ownership the potential of one accident is there.If we want guarantees that nothing is going to happen then we have to limit the ownership to one single dog.I foster and chose to do so based on what I can offer a few dogs, which includes safety.I am aware of the risks since they come with the territory and I am only human.
My only accident so far happened out of nowhere and with two dogs who have gotten along greatly for a while.No posturing, no triggers, no nothing.A foster was by my side and one second later he grabbed a little guy by the neck (one of my own).One single solid hold and a breaking stick separated them and both dogs are still here, after several vet bills due to the puncture wounds getting infected.Damn emergency vets and their ideas to put staples everywhere! The dog is not a pit bull but he is scarred quite badly because some tissues died with the infection.It wasn't intentional, no dog fighting involved.
Sometime there is no reason for an accident, it just happens.Genetic kicks in.I don't consider myself a dumbass nor unable to own these dogs, especially thinking of some big name in the pit bull world who have lost several dogs to yard fights.That is bad management only more than an unfortunate accident.Bad management is going to kill dogs of any breed.
If it is not dog aggression it is a loose dog being hit by a car or an idiotic owner who wanted to a high drive working dog, could not deal with what came with it and surrendered him.Many dogs are killed just because someone moves across the town and is not willing to find a place that takes the dog.

[SisMorphine]

Okay I only started reading this thread, admittedly haven't gotten through even half of it, just had to reply to this one:

As far as scars go a scar here a there is no big deal. There is a big difference between dog bites, hog bites, tree scratches ect. Lots of dogs have a few scars here and there, but when you have torn ears, muzzle, face chest and leg scars thats when there is a problem

My dog has a ripped ear and scars on his muzzle. Am I fighting him? Absolutely not! And, get this folks, HE'S A GREYHOUND! A Greyhound with scars on his muzzle and a torn ear? *shock* *gasp*

His "battle wounds" tell a story of his rank in the kennel pack. These scars don't mean he was fought in the kennel, they mean that he was the most dominant, "King Poopy" (as his kennel manager called him), dog there. Others tried to overthrow the throne but he stood his ground. Two of the scars that he has on his nose are from my old boss' dog. Again, he silently and confidently stood his ground and he never had another problem with her.

He was never fought but he has these "worrisome" scars. Would an animal cruelty investigator take away my dog for these wounds?

[Marinepits]

The black dog is not out in the streets so his dog aggression is nobody's concern but mine. That is how it works when the breed is cared for by appropriate people.I do not like dog aggression nor look for it but this breed offer more than that so I deal with it.

My point-of-view as well, Red.

[bouvierz]

Well I can see that this is a typical forum that if you disagree or have questions out of the norm that everyone gets defensive and starts making stupid comments. I know that sometimes dogs who have always gotten along will sometimes start fighting. I believe I already mentioned it, the "ACCIDENTS" I dont get are the one that happen with dogs who you already know are DA. I have had hundreds of dogs in my home of all differernt Temperments and I have NEVER had an incedent!!!! ( but I know one poster believes Im hiding some kind of incident) Just lucky I guess. I make sure any dog that has an issue is locked up before I let the next one out. My fosters are never out unattended if they are problem children. None of my comments are directed at any of you directly they are just observations. I have heard many of you talk about rehomeing your dog, and putting them to sleep due to dog aggression so I guess it is a problem isnt it. As far as some of you go that have dogs with severe scars or injuries thats sad for you and your dogs As far as being investigated goes if we got a complaint on you we would look into it. As long as there isnt proof of dog fighting and you have proper vet reports your ok. DA and irresponsiable ownership is what is killing this breed. As far as Im concerned if I had to loose some traits in the Pit bull to save it for banning, fighting, and all the terrible things I see on a DAILY occurance then ok. ( what traits do you think we would loose anyway)Im good with that. My dogs, kids and job are my life. I dedicate my exsistance on helping all animals have a bettter life. And again my questions were not really asked. This thread is getting old and im sure that my points will continued to be argued. I believe(along with many, many,many others) there is a problem with dog aggression!!!!Thanks anyways If my comments make you mad im sorry best suggestion is to avoid them.

[mnp13]

I have heard many of you talk about rehomeing your dog, and putting them to sleep due to dog aggression so I guess it is a problem isnt it.

What are you talking about? Name names. Yes, I'm serious. there are about 75 active members here' "many" would be at least 10... or I'll even go down to 6. Find me six people who want to get rid of their dog or put their dog down because of dog aggression.

As far as being investigated goes if we got a complaint on you we would look into it. As long as there isnt proof of dog fighting and you have proper vet reports your ok.

"proof of dog fighting"? Like what? Scarred dogs, a spring pole, maybe a treadmill? Sounds like a witch hunt to me.

DA and irresponsiable ownership is what is killing this breed.

No. irresponsible ownership is what is killing this breed, along with the idiot reporters who will do anything to have their name attached to a "big story". Dog aggression has nothing to do with it. The VAST majority of Pit Bulls are fine with other dogs or are easily manged.

[Maryellen]

have heard many of you talk about rehomeing your dog, and putting them to sleep due to dog aggression so I guess it is a problem isnt it. As far as some of you go that have dogs with severe scars or injuries thats sad for you and your dogs

your kidding right bouvierz???? i mean seriously, name people here that are rehoming their dogs....

all the dogs in the rescue section are in rescues.. not personal dogs.. i think before you assume you should check the facts. and to say that we are like other forums , well, hello, we all have opinions, and we all like to discuss them.. this forum is actually the best one around,as we dont ban people for having opinions, we allow heated discussions as long as there are no name calling, and we can all agree to disagree..

so , start naming names of people here that are rehoming their dogs per your quote above....

and i can think of one person in rescue that should be investigated and shut down, but i wont even go there..

[cheekymunkee]

You have been asked several times for examples to back up your claims of what people do & say on this board. I think it is time you stop making baseless claims if you can't support them. If our "stupid comments" bother you so much, stop making stupid remarks. You have insinuated PLENTY about the people of this board, now it is time to put up or shut up.

[bouvierz]

What claims would you like me to back up? Id be glad to do so?