Me no likey!

This is where to talk about Pit Bulls!

Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 9:56 am

TheRedQueen wrote:
Megumi-Oni wrote:You're assuming much here, my friend. I usually don't see more than a dozen dogs at a time at this park. And, if there are too many, I don't go. Again, you're assuming much without regard to what may actually be the case, and that by definition, is ignorance.


I'm going by the information you gave me (that you take your dog to a dog park) and by what first hand info I have on dog parks (the ones around me are always crowded). I asked, as did others...what is your dog park like? And you never answered...so I had to go by what I personally know. Don't tell me I'm ignorant when I had to use what I know to go by. I was clarifying MY argument...why I don't go to dog parks, and why I don't think they're good for dog-dog socialization. :neutral:

Furthermore, my dog park (as commented on SPBR) is NOT 60-70 dogs running around willy nilly as they say. It's maybe a dozen, max. And when there's too many, I leave. SO, fundamentally, it is NO DIFFERENT THAN HAVING A PLAY DATE IN YOUR BACK YARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


yeah, it still kinda is. When I have dogs over in my backyard...they are dogs that I know/trust. I know if Freckles and Fig don't get along, I can leave one in the house when we're out back. I know that Jake and Inara might have issues with the soccer ball, so I can leave one of them inside or put the soccer ball away. I know that Score gets upset when Henri steals his ball...so I can leave one of them inside. Much different than a dog park, where it's harder to rotate the troops around. If I have friends over with their dogs, I know I can trust them to watch their dogs and to know what they see...and I can trust them not to get angry at me if I step in and stop their dog from something rude/nasty/potentially dangerous.


I did answer. All you have to do is read the whole list of posts before making ignorant assumptions.


Holy hell, you didn't read. You don't get it. The dogs and people I associate with at the park ARE TRUSTED INDIVIDUALS I HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Ugh. I said it a million times already, but you people ignorantly and blatantly disregard those key points just to serve your own arrogant points of view and debunk me for having a different and unpopular opinion! How am I NOT supposed to react with such anger? GO READ MY POSTS BEFORE YOU MAKE AN ASSUMPTION!
Last edited by Megumi-Oni on October 16th, 2009, 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby TheRedQueen » October 16th, 2009, 9:57 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:Really guys, I think you're assuming too much and not reading enough. I'm doing none of the irrepsonsible things you imply I'm doing, other than going to the park to begin with. I'm so done trying to convince you intolerant, arrogant, narrow minded elitists that I'm not getting my dog involved with a giant doggie cluster bomb at some public place where there are just ignorant fools haphazardly shooing dogs around. Really! Holy hell, will you people please ACTUALLY READ what I'm doing instead of attacking me on an ASSUMPTION!

:mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2:


Gee, welcome to PBT...I'm so glad you joined... :rolleyes2:

Why exactly did you join again?
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Postby DeeNtheChillas » October 16th, 2009, 10:00 am

Megumi, perhaps you need to stop and realize that despite the fact that not all of us agree on many counts - many of us don't agree with the people on PB-Smiles about things, many of us here don't agree with each other about things - what most pit bull people DO agree on is no dog parks. I don't even own a pit bull and I don't do dog parks because I have two terrier mixes, one of whom is selectively DA. It just isn't the right setting for her, no matter what the setup is of said park. I just won't put her in that situation, for her own safety, and for the safety of other dogs.

Granted, I didn't read all of every post in this thread, but I browsed them, and I read your thread on PB-Smiles. You are very passionate about YOUR park and YOUR situation. Fine. We are very passionate about the good of the pit bull breed. Usually, that includes no dog parks. Leashed in a park, that's fine, it's a way to show your dog is a good ambassador for the breed. There is a huge difference.
Dee and the furry babies:
Lizz (11 y/o beagle x toy fox terrier)
Blazer (7 y/o chihuahua x boston terrier)
Valentino (less than a year old pit bull)
Tyler and Victoria, the kitties
and the 'chillas
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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:00 am

LMM wrote:I'm scared for someone's safety :shock:


That's because you're not reading the entire thread and getting the whole story. Try again.
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Postby maberi » October 16th, 2009, 10:02 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:Instead of letting the media push you around, why not stand up for yourself and your dog and say "no, I will not let you treat my dog as a scape goat just because it's been made easy. Here's proof that you're wrong." Then produce the proof. Take a video camera with you, as I do. Do anything to help expose the JQP to your wonderful animals, and when they try to react, hold them accountable!

What I'm gathering here is that most of you seem to want to hide from the fact that your breed has been DEMONIZED by the irresponsible acts of others, and the irresponsible reporting by journalists and news anchors. The ONLY way to battle that stigma is to become involved with the COMMUNITY... not just your perfect little circles of friend who all say in a backyard someplace.


I think you are missing the fact that although we do not agree with taking our dogs to dog parks to play off leash, we have no problem taking our dogs out in public in a safe fashion. None of us are hiding inside our houses with the curtains closed (well maybe on weekends when we wake up with a hang over or when we are wearing Vibram Five Finger shoes).

Many of us compete in dog sports (weight pull, flyball, agility, dock diving, protection sports, etc.. etc...), competitive obedience, some have therapy dogs, while others are active in rescue work and fighting BSL. The list goes on and on.

The COMMUNITY is NOT the dog park. By putting our dogs in a situation in which they could fail, we are not helping their plight. There is a reason you are seeing such strong opposition on this subject. Many of us have been down that road and have learned the hard way. The dog scraps you may have seen from time to time at a dog park by other dogs are nothing compared to what our dogs are capable of. I can take my Lab to a dog park with other dogs (although I don't because he doesn't really care for them and I feel they are unsafe for all dogs). If he gets into a spat with another dog, there may be some cuts and scrapes, but at the end of the day, both dogs will probably walk away unscathed. If I take my pit to that same dog park and another dog decides they want to pick a fight with him the end result will probably be much different. This isn't a situation where we think our dogs are the cool tough dog on the block. This is a plain and simple fact that our dogs were bred for years to do a job, and no amount of focus work or obedience is going to override that innate drive to fight if that drive kicks in :|
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Postby LMM » October 16th, 2009, 10:06 am

Hey new guy, seriously do you not recognize heated debate for what it is? No one is attacking you.

Just like you are allowed your opinion, others are allowed theirs. Your defensive nature is making this more than it needs to be. I realize you are very passionate about this and that's great. If you have a controlled situation, well great for you! However, this is NOT the norm when it comes to dog parks and that is just what quite a few people are trying to demonstrate to you through their own experiences. Yes people here have loads of experience, yes people here have owned this breed for many years, and yes people here know their own dogs and will NOT set them up to fail. That does not equate to anyone hiding their dogs, living in a bubble, bowing down to the sensationalistic media or any other load of crap you've posted. That just means we know our dogs, we know our breed, and we handle them accordingly.

My dogs do not go to dog parks, not because I'm feeding into the fear mongering machine that is the media :rolleyes2: but because I don't want to set them up for failure. Or worse in my area, death. If a fight breaks out, no matter who is to blame, my dog (being the pit bull) will be confiscated. And my dog's punishment will likely be a death sentence. That's just not a chance I'm willing to take. And quite frankly, they don't need any more doggy friends to be socialized. They get plenty of socialization in other ways.

My dogs are really great and laid back dogs but they can be dog selective. Actually they are sometimesy in general when it comes to dogs.. While one day they are happy go lucky, any dog can shove its nose up their butt and they'll be cool with it, on the very next day they could be ready to rumble over a puff of air.
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Postby LMM » October 16th, 2009, 10:07 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:
cheekymunkee wrote:
It's so easy to have such a strong attitude when you can hide behind a computer screen. The only difference I can see is that I'd say this stuff direct to anyone, in person, and with the same conviction and passion.


And here's a newsflash for you dude. The same thing can be said by about 95% of the members here.
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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:10 am

I stated why I joined the forum. It's the first post I ever made. Did you miss that one too?

Really people. I'm not saying you're wrong. And I'm not saying I will always have success in every situation. I'm reacting the way I am because I'm being cornered and attacked for having a different opinion. That opinion could change, over time, if I thought we were discussing the point. But instead, I feel like everyone is just very snobbish about offering their experience and trying to pawn me off as someone I'm clearly not, if you'd bother to see the bigger picture.

My real problem isn't the information being shared here. It's the fact that I can't offer my own opinion without being slapped down for it. That, in essence, is elitist snobbish social behavior motivated by a very narrow view of the world. That, by definition, is ignorance. If we can all just accept that we're all different, that'd be fine.

My actions aren't creating BSL. I feel that BSL is created when the media gets into it and makes a sensation over "Woman found dead in proximity to pit bull." The issue isn't how we choose to socialize our dogs (though that is indeed part of it), it's now that socialization is reported when it inevitably goes sour, as it can do with ANY breed of dog. I feel I do my part by standing up for myself and my dog, and when someone else let's their Weim in and it comes after my pup, I tell them to leave. And they leave, because I'm not the only "pit" owner in that park. It's just that simple.

So, what solution is there? I say write letters to news casters and journalists when they report something poorly, or don't offer the "full" story. Hold them accountable for their fear mongering, rather than letting it corral us into submission.

That is all.
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Postby LMM » October 16th, 2009, 10:11 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:
LMM wrote:I'm scared for someone's safety :shock:


That's because you're not reading the entire thread and getting the whole story. Try again.



I was actually saying that in reference to your post to one particular person here lol



Pipe down with all the hostility. Do you have a vein leaning outside of your forehead right about now? It's not necessary. It's a discussion.
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Postby DeeNtheChillas » October 16th, 2009, 10:13 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:Instead of letting the media push you around, why not stand up for yourself and your dog and say "no, I will not let you treat my dog as a scape goat just because it's been made easy. Here's proof that you're wrong." Then produce the proof. Take a video camera with you, as I do. Do anything to help expose the JQP to your wonderful animals, and when they try to react, hold them accountable!

What I'm gathering here is that most of you seem to want to hide from the fact that your breed has been DEMONIZED by the irresponsible acts of others, and the irresponsible reporting by journalists and news anchors. The ONLY way to battle that stigma is to become involved with the COMMUNITY... not just your perfect little circles of friend who all say in a backyard someplace.


Did you not get into a JMC school or something? It is normal for pit bull people to recognize the media as one factor among many in bringing about the bad name this breed has but you really seem to have a hatred for journalists that is overly large.
Dee and the furry babies:
Lizz (11 y/o beagle x toy fox terrier)
Blazer (7 y/o chihuahua x boston terrier)
Valentino (less than a year old pit bull)
Tyler and Victoria, the kitties
and the 'chillas
Humble Acres Chinchillas
http://www.humbleacreschinchillas.com
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Postby DemoDick » October 16th, 2009, 10:17 am

Like I said guys, OP is a "true believer." No point in discussing anything with a delusional wreck.

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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:17 am

LMM wrote:Pipe down with all the hostility. Do you have a vein leaning outside of your forehead right about now? It's not necessary. It's a discussion.


Heh... no. Actually my therepist has given me some great coping tools that help me stay calm even when I'm being passionate about something. It's pretty neat, modern mind control techniques. lol :o

Anyway, yeah. You're right. I can read back and see how people didn't at all get upset with me for suggesting my dog did ok at a park. Ms. ColbyDogs never, ever expressed a strong, sarcastic opinion opposing mine. Nobody here has ever used a tone which could have rubbed anyone else the wrong way. It's cool though. I'm doing my 1-2-3, nothing bothers me thing, and I'm moving on.

I don't know how to multiple quote yet, so I have to respond to something else real quick...
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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:17 am

DeeNtheChillas wrote:Did you not get into a JMC school or something? It is normal for pit bull people to recognize the media as one factor among many in bringing about the bad name this breed has but you really seem to have a hatred for journalists that is overly large.


Actually, no. I finished Engineering school. I is edumacated! Weeeee! :dance:
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Postby DeeNtheChillas » October 16th, 2009, 10:19 am

Well, be careful with your over-generalizations about the media. I support placing blame on them but your broad-based hatred is misplaced on some of us who write "Reporter" on forms where it asks "job title." :smileUp:
Dee and the furry babies:
Lizz (11 y/o beagle x toy fox terrier)
Blazer (7 y/o chihuahua x boston terrier)
Valentino (less than a year old pit bull)
Tyler and Victoria, the kitties
and the 'chillas
Humble Acres Chinchillas
http://www.humbleacreschinchillas.com
DeeNtheChillas
Snot Nose Bully Pup
 
Posts: 118
Location: Western NY

Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:20 am

DemoDick wrote:Like I said guys, OP is a "true believer." No point in discussing anything with a delusional wreck.

Demo Dick


Delusional wreck. So, this whole time I've refrained from actually calling someone a name directly, and then you pop the cherry. Congrats! I like your conviction!

But, if a moderator is going to tell me to stop name calling, I think it should apply universally. It's only fair. Or, are you one of the ones "on the inside?"

I'm glad you feel so defeated though. I mean, forget the fact that I've shown I recognize your point of view, and I've shown the ability to operate on the higher levels of Bloom's Taxonomy with your ideals... I mean, that doesn't count for anything, right? The fact that I can take what you say and offer a rebuttle... does that upset you more, or just that I offered a different opinion to begin with?

Yey! I love you guys! This is fun!
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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:21 am

DeeNtheChillas wrote:Well, be careful with your over-generalizations about the media. I support placing blame on them but your broad-based hatred is misplaced on some of us who write "Reporter" on forms where it asks "job title." :smileUp:


I think I did specify at some point... RESPONSIBLE reporting. That's a key difference. Don't be a sensationalist pig and you're ok in my book! :D
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Postby TheRedQueen » October 16th, 2009, 10:24 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:I stated why I joined the forum. It's the first post I ever made. Did you miss that one too?


Sorry, I missed your post about joining the forum to fight against every member on the board...all while lacking a sense of humor. Missed that one. :|

And just to add...I seriously do not care if you take your dog to the dog park...I really, really don't. It doesn't change my life one iota if you do or don't. However, I do believe that others reading these posts need to know why it's a bad idea.
"I don't have any idea if my dogs respect me or not, but they're greedy and I have their stuff." -- Patty Ruzzo

"Dogs don't want to control people. They want to control their own lives." --John Bradshaw
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Postby DemoDick » October 16th, 2009, 10:25 am

Call your therapist. Right now. Have them look at this thread. You need help.

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Postby LMM » October 16th, 2009, 10:25 am

Megumi-Oni wrote:
LMM wrote:Pipe down with all the hostility. Do you have a vein leaning outside of your forehead right about now? It's not necessary. It's a discussion.


Heh... no. Actually my therepist has given me some great coping tools that help me stay calm even when I'm being passionate about something. It's pretty neat, modern mind control techniques. lol :o

Anyway, yeah. You're right. I can read back and see how people didn't at all get upset with me for suggesting my dog did ok at a park. Ms. ColbyDogs never, ever expressed a strong, sarcastic opinion opposing mine. Nobody here has ever used a tone which could have rubbed anyone else the wrong way. It's cool though. I'm doing my 1-2-3, nothing bothers me thing, and I'm moving on.

I don't know how to multiple quote yet, so I have to respond to something else real quick...


I think you are getting forums confused. This is just a tip, don't bring your luggage from another forum to THIS one.

I am curious how you read tone though? That's a neat trick!
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Postby Megumi-Oni » October 16th, 2009, 10:30 am

TheRedQueen wrote:Sorry, I missed your post about joining the forum to fight against every member on the board...all while lacking a sense of humor. Missed that one. :|


No problem. If my statement is what stirred the hornet's nest, then I'm afraid I'm a little more idealistic than I thought. My bad, yo! But, I feel like if I combine this thread with the training thread I started, I'll find a group of hypocrites. "Don't expose your dog to bad press" but "teach your dog to bite humans because it's a fun sport." How does that work, exactly? Please, allow me to read that other thread more completely after work this evening because I'm actually VERY interested in how one can say "you can't control a dog past its instincts" but then turn around and say something to the effect of showing the JQP a disciplined dog despite distractions, etc... I dunno I gotta read it again but my first reaction was a little questioning of the consistency of opinion here.

TheRedQueen wrote:And just to add...I seriously do not care if you take your dog to the dog park...I really, really don't. It doesn't change my life one iota if you do or don't. However, I do believe that others reading these posts need to know why it's a bad idea.


Ok, no problem. I respect that.
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