The TRUTH about Lila

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Postby Maryellen » March 19th, 2006, 11:31 am

oonce you pulled lila from the shelter eric she was now your responsibilty and the rescues. the shelter releases all liability once a rescue pulls a dog. so the responsibility is now yours.
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Postby Purple » March 19th, 2006, 11:32 am

clarity wrote:isn't it in the upper left of the posts, vicki?

if you'd like, i can post the thread links

basically, lila came in on a saturday, and was shot late that following wednesday night.


Purple wrote:Could you include the date stamp on her posts Eric, I just want a feel of the time frame.


My bad, E, I didn't see it....Sorry.
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:33 am

Here's a very good thread where Eric is looking for a foster for the mom and babies.
http://spbr.org/pbsmiles/upload/showthread.php?t=3043

You can note that Doreen had apparently never fostered babies before, since she asks alot of questions about the process.

Perhaps, Eric, you should have gone with a more experienced foster home for the mom and babies?
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:35 am

haha, maryellen -- i allowed one same-sex adoption once to an experienced owner with two sisters -- and your attempts to smear me here will fail --

-- here is what i got from her last week -- this is the only "same sex" situation i have ever allowed, since the owner was very savvy -- in the future, i wouldn't do it again, probably just because i worry about them so much --

-- any other questions, ME?

"The girls are doing great. Both are around 50 pounds and stayed on the small side. Flora (a.k.a "The Bullet") is the bossy talker. She'll wedge herself between you and the couch if you're sitting where she wants to. Eventually you lose out. Bella on the other hand, thinks she a lap dog.
Yesterday Bella had minor surgery on her back paw. She broke a nail! Actually it split horizontally and the top half turned dark but was still attached inside the paw. The vet had to open it up a bit and cut out the dying part. She's now sporting a kelly green bandage (how very Irish!) which she's pretty good about not chewing at - yet. I suspect I'll get home one night and find it shredded
"

Maryellen wrote:
No doubt, I love her, but puppies, notoriously find homes much easier than the adults. One reason why we are keeping the momma, plus she's an absolute doll. Also, we already have momma Satin and we def. couldn't have three dogs....


eric, you allow same sex adoptions?? you know that same sex adoptions should not be, due to the dog on dog aggression in this breed,.
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Postby Maryellen » March 19th, 2006, 11:35 am

ps- if you can not assess a pit bull for its temperment and must rely on other people and trainers then you shouldnt be in rescue.. if you are in rescue you should have learned the proper temperments of the breed and the proper way to temperment test them. anyone who allows a stranger of a shelter or a trainer to evaluate a dog especially a pit bull instead of you evaluating the dog should not be in rescue. you are placing the breed and humans at risk.
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:36 am

doreen had a the full force of a the forum behind her, offering help and advice, and people, like alyssa, going to her house to help.

she offered to help, and was open to advice (and donations), and everything seemed positive --

-- these two adults seemed fully competent and ready to foster, and we were willing to help them in any way we could to get everyone great homes --

-- if you don't start somewhere, how do you ever do anything?

msvette2u wrote:Here's a very good thread where Eric is looking for a foster for the mom and babies.
http://spbr.org/pbsmiles/upload/showthread.php?t=3043

You can note that Doreen had apparently never fostered babies before, since she asks alot of questions about the process.

Perhaps, Eric, you should have gone with a more experienced foster home for the mom and babies?
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:38 am

this is your opinion, maryellen, and the shelter staff where Lila came from was very pit-savvy, so i think their assessment would qualify as "professional", whereas a judge would view yours and mine as "hobby" --



Maryellen wrote:ps- if you can not assess a pit bull for its temperment and must rely on other people and trainers then you shouldnt be in rescue.. if you are in rescue you should have learned the proper temperments of the breed and the proper way to temperment test them. anyone who allows a stranger of a shelter or a trainer to evaluate a dog especially a pit bull instead of you evaluating the dog should not be in rescue. you are placing the breed and humans at risk.
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Postby Carla » March 19th, 2006, 11:39 am

cheekymunkee wrote: And this guy is a pit bull rescue???.


Happens more and more today, I believe.

We all know how few and far between good, knowledgable, safe homes ARE for this breed. I can't imagine it's much different with "rescues"....the last place on EARTH I'd let one of MY dogs get into...

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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:40 am

i'm wondering, then, mary, why didn't brian and doreen tell me of this green-dot?

it seems to have a large significance on things, 5 months later, but was disregarded back then --

-- and doreen's statements about how "wonderful" lila was that fateful week led me to believe everything was positive with the experience --

Maryellen wrote:oonce you pulled lila from the shelter eric she was now your responsibilty and the rescues. the shelter releases all liability once a rescue pulls a dog. so the responsibility is now yours.
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:42 am

OK...so if you did not meet and assess Lila yourself how can you second guess what happened?

It's sad that Doreen's first mom/puppy foster turned into such a negative thing. From what it sounds like, they regret what happened as well.
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:43 am

so, what'syour adoption process, carla -- please tell me --

-- from the moment a dog is taken in, or a puppy is birthed, till the adopter closes its door with the dog-in-hand --

eric

Carla wrote:
cheekymunkee wrote: And this guy is a pit bull rescue???.


Happens more and more today, I believe.

We all know how few and far between good, knowledgable, safe homes ARE for this breed. I can't imagine it's much different with "rescues"....the last place on EARTH I'd let one of MY dogs get into...

Carla
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:43 am

Carla wrote:
cheekymunkee wrote: And this guy is a pit bull rescue???.


Happens more and more today, I believe.

We all know how few and far between good, knowledgable, safe homes ARE for this breed. I can't imagine it's much different with "rescues"....the last place on EARTH I'd let one of MY dogs get into...

Carla


You're right. There ARE some pretty bad places out there that call themselves "rescues".
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:44 am

i trusted doreen's statements that everything was "great" and that lila was the "sweetest" --

-- and alyssa also saw her that weekend, and said the same thing --

-- if doreen would have said, "Please come get her", i would have --

-- but SHOOTING her, when she didn't even BITE?

isn't this rationale for ANY human to have against animal frightening?

as i mentioned, you know what the result would be if your dog ever got in a tift with brian's --

-- he'd shoot it dead.


msvette2u wrote:OK...so if you did not meet and assess Lila yourself how can you second guess what happened?

It's sad that Doreen's first mom/puppy foster turned into such a negative thing. From what it sounds like, they regret what happened as well.
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:44 am

clarity wrote:i'm wondering, then, mary, why didn't brian and doreen tell me of this green-dot?

it seems to have a large significance on things, 5 months later, but was disregarded back then --

-- and doreen's statements about how "wonderful" lila was that fateful week led me to believe everything was positive with the experience --

Maryellen wrote:oonce you pulled lila from the shelter eric she was now your responsibilty and the rescues. the shelter releases all liability once a rescue pulls a dog. so the responsibility is now yours.


At that time, Doreen and her husband didn't KNOW what the green dot meant?? Nobody told them what it meant, and nobody found out until much later, if I'm reading this all correctly?
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:47 am

clarity wrote:-- but SHOOTING her, when she didn't even BITE?



From what I read it sounds like the dog was not just standing there politely either.

Any one of us in the same situation would not have stood there and waited TO be bitten, and in this case, likely mauled.

What would your reaction be, had this been "merely" a mauling, either massive and/or fatal, and not a shooting?

(edited to fix the weird quote thingie)
Last edited by msvette2u on March 19th, 2006, 11:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:47 am

neither they nor i knew what it meant --

-- but they knew it was there, and i didn't --

-- so it was negligence on the shelter's side, for not telling them, or irresponsibility on their side, for not asking --

-- had it been me, i would have asked, "Um, what does this green dot mean?"

Why did doreen keep saying lila was a sweetheart??

e



msvette2u wrote:
clarity wrote:i'm wondering, then, mary, why didn't brian and doreen tell me of this green-dot?

it seems to have a large significance on things, 5 months later, but was disregarded back then --

-- and doreen's statements about how "wonderful" lila was that fateful week led me to believe everything was positive with the experience --

Maryellen wrote:oonce you pulled lila from the shelter eric she was now your responsibilty and the rescues. the shelter releases all liability once a rescue pulls a dog. so the responsibility is now yours.


At that time, Doreen and her husband didn't KNOW what the green dot meant?? Nobody told them what it meant, and nobody found out until much later, if I'm reading this all correctly?
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:49 am

what about SHUTTING THE DOOR and calling ANIMAL CONTROL?

is this humanity, to shoot a growling dog, of the breed we love?

and the murder, i am sure, didn't happen "painlessly" -- there was likely blood loss, which eventually caused death --

-- what about MUZZLING, or RESTRAINING?

hell, if i shot all the dogs i've encountered that were showing canine traits (like here, protecting her babies), i wouldn't sleep at night.




msvette2u wrote:
clarity wrote:-- but SHOOTING her, when she didn't even BITE?

It's sad that Doreen's first mom/puppy foster turned into such a negative thing. From what it sounds like, they regret what happened as well.


From what I read it sounds like the dog was not just standing there politely either.

Any one of us in the same situation would not have stood there and waited TO be bitten, and in this case, likely mauled.

What would your reaction be, had this been "merely" a mauling, either massive and/or fatal, and not a shooting?[/quote]
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Postby msvette2u » March 19th, 2006, 11:54 am

No, I asked "What would your reaction be, NOW, had Brian gotten mauled?" (Can you answer that?)

As for shutting the door, Doreen was IN the room. What kind of man shuts his wife in the room with a dog that just tried to attack HIM?

She didn't mention it (aggression) because she didn't SEE it until a day or two into the deal.

You and I both know that there are times when pit bulls are unstable due to breeding, and circumstances (such as, she's never been shown love by humans).
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:56 am

okay - i am going to walk and feed --

-- and then post surgery photos on my website from a recent mass cell tumor procedure at my vet, with hopes of encouraging folks to vet their dogs as they age --

-- if you'd like to visit my site, it's here -- http://www.spbr.org --

here i talk about diet --

http://www.spbr.org/raw/rawmeal/rawmeal.htm

and have posted an atts temperament test in my videos --

http://www.spbr.org/video/Videos.htm

and have also a library section, showing how painless and easy spay/neuter efforts can be for owners (and their dogs!) --

http://www.spbr.org/Library/library.htm

i am far from an irresponsible owner or rescue -- and i ask people to stay on the topics of justifying lila's death-by-shooting here --

-- i think the smear campaigns that are being attempted make the alleger look foolish, and prevent us from giving lila the diginity she deserves --

eric
Last edited by Eric - SPBR on March 19th, 2006, 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Eric - SPBR » March 19th, 2006, 11:58 am

i don't think "mauling" would have occurred, had doreen left the room, and brian crated the dog --

-- there are a lot of "what ifs" to be asked here --

-- what if brian accidentally shot his wife?

do you know how odd it is to carry a loaded firearm around the house?

okay, i will check back later --

msvette2u wrote:No, I asked "What would your reaction be, NOW, had Brian gotten mauled?" (Can you answer that?)

As for shutting the door, Doreen was IN the room. What kind of man shuts his wife in the room with a dog that just tried to attack HIM?

She didn't mention it (aggression) because she didn't SEE it until a day or two into the deal.

You and I both know that there are times when pit bulls are unstable due to breeding, and circumstances (such as, she's never been shown love by humans).
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