Starting the pull

Weight pull, Protection, Agility, Flyball... you name it!

Postby mnp13 » May 25th, 2006, 8:31 pm

I've got a 'starting up' question...

Riggs will pull once we get going but I'm having a hard time getting him to start the weight. If I pull the leash he gets going and then he'll truck right along with no problem...

so how do I get him moving?
Michelle

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Postby dogcrazyjen » May 25th, 2006, 10:08 pm

From what I understand, and have seen with Tallulah, you may be using too much weight.

I started off with the empty sled, then added very slowly more weight. If I had to help her, I went too fast. Adding only a few pounds every day or two is all you need for weeks and weeks, to build confidence and muscles.

I also start each session with a light weight (5-10 pounds) to get her in the swing of things.

I am assuming that as she progresses, I can increase that practice weight until it is the equivilant to the starting competition weight she will need to pull- 75 pounds on wheels translated to a drag sled.

I am interested to read Grizzly and other's responses, to see if I am on the right track.

Good question!
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Postby grizzly » May 25th, 2006, 10:31 pm

first- when he gets going does he pull it well?
if you can tell he is not having trouble with the weight then its mental defiance
griz used to do the same thing and will still do it when the weights get heavy
i'm quessing your working light with riggs, right?
i think the gest cure would be super high reps of light weight
drill the format into riggs head that when you walk away from him he MUST do everything in his power to follow you
short distance-10ft or so
5 sets of 10 pulls each night for a week staight( every night no days off-building mind, not muscle)
rest between sets but not between reps
this should be a quick workout because its all mental
sometimes you will see me stop and walk away from griz repeatedly at a pull and that to keep him ontop of the heal command
dogs like most animals are creatures of habit
one or two weeks of everynight pulling will make it a habit for him to come when you leave him
i hope your not getting frustrated with him because he will pick up on your tension and could be getting him off track
you have8 days until enfield
do this exercise every night until then
don't work the heavy weights at all
riggs can pull 1200lbs easily without any condititioning
work on his mind- make him do it
i bet he will do very well with just the mental workout
good luck!!!!
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Postby mnp13 » May 26th, 2006, 8:10 am

He's pulling a single car tire on grass attached directly to his harness. Once he gets going there he moves right along until he just stops and looks at me "I don't feel like it any more". So I make him go again until I say "stop".

I don't think it's a weight issue because he's trucking right along with it. Of course, we're in grass so there is some variation to the resistance.

5 sets of 10 reps it is then. Dumb question: is that in a line, or do I turn him around and bring him back to the beginning each time? I'd probably do that work in the parking lot since it's not a lot of weight so we won't rip his feet up.

I don't think I'm getting frusterated because I'm in 'figure it out' mode.
Michelle

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Postby mnp13 » May 26th, 2006, 11:17 pm

We did the short pulls today like you suggested. I started with the leash on for the first 2 sets, then we did some with the leash off. It was raining so I went to a pavilion in the park near my house and we went back and forth in there.

He was mostly good. we had a few moments when he had to be reminded that pulling means go forward, not backward.

Then he decided to jump onto the picnic table, with the tire still attached. :rolleyes2:

I can definately see how this exercise will help us, hopefully it will make a difference in time to give us a little success next weekend.
Michelle

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Postby grizzly » May 27th, 2006, 1:58 am

michelle pleasepull on dirt or grass
concreate doesn't allow the dog to use his nails
he cant use the right form without his nails

michelle can you run 100 yrds?
how about 1000yds much harder right?riggs has the strength to pull the load but not the endurance
thats where the low weight high reps come in
you could also do low weight long distance(not more than a mile or so)
low weight builds mental strength and enduance
once successful at this stage you would start heavy conditioning


they call them down&backs
down is one rep back is another

there are no dumb questions
your only dumb if you dont ask
knowage is power

again michelle PLEASE PULL ON DIRT you could really screw up all your training on the cocrete or blacktop
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Postby mnp13 » May 27th, 2006, 6:15 am

Dirt it is then. What should I have him pull? the only reason I did it on the concrete was to lower the resistance on the tire so we could focus on the "down and back" instead of focusing on the resistance. Or am I just being overly sensitive and he is perfictly capable of pulling a tire for the down and backs? He definately has to work to pull in the grass.

I'll have to start hunting around the local parks for dirt paths
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Postby grizzly » May 28th, 2006, 12:06 am

its tough to find good spots to train
i dragged on one dirt road and these three dogs were running loose and barking at us the hole time( i'm glad they just barked-must of been intimidated by grizzlys size)non the less i never went back to that road lagain
i have this one dirt road that works great it sarts off with a steep short uphill into a long sloping downhill(cool down)to level ground-at the half mile mark i turn around and head back up the now sloping uphill into the short downhill(cool down)
i like the dirt roads because there packed well from all the trafficthey get
if you think its too heavy ditch the tire and get a piece of chain(thicker the better) longer the heavier- easy way to adjust the weight just keep adding short piecesof chain( with carabineror such)don't try to make less resistance the resistance builds muscle
resistance=less weight you have to move to train with
but if its too much lower your weight
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Postby Pitcrew » May 28th, 2006, 8:15 pm

Great help Grizz!

Where in upstate NY are you?
"Pedigree indicates what the animal should be;
Conformation indicates what the animal appears to be;
But, Performance indicates what the animal actually is."
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Postby grizzly » May 29th, 2006, 12:02 am

[quGreat help Grizz!

Where in upstate NY are you? [/quote]

ya know we have a tread for that info -just kidding
i'm between saratoga and lake george in a small town called argyle
my town is so small its still a dry town (going back to the prohabition)
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Postby mnp13 » May 30th, 2006, 1:17 pm

We trained this weekend and Riggs is doing very well. On Sunday and Monday I had someone hold the tire with a leash for resistance at the beginning of each pull with the intent of showing him that even if it's hard to start once he gets moving it gets easier.

I also learned the problem with a pattern... it's a pattern. I've been doing down and backs, turning him 180 degrees after each short pull. Well, I decided to go down the dirt road and after the first stop he started to turn himself around. Oops, training error!!! One sharp "no" got him headed back in the right direction though.

I'm hoping this makes a difference for this weekend, but we shall see. I am determined not to get down on him if he decides not to pull for me. It's my fault, not his. Well, not completely his anyway!
Michelle

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Postby grizzly » May 30th, 2006, 9:56 pm

i think what we need here is a pic of how much fun the two of you are having
riggs is having fun isn't he?
i would love to see a side view of him dragging in form
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Postby mnp13 » May 30th, 2006, 10:11 pm

Yes, we're having a lot of fun actually. I'll see if I can get someone to take a picture for me. tomorrow we're going to have to pull at 7 am, because it's going to be 90 here again tomorrow.

We didn't pull today, I didn't think it was a good idea to do in 95 degree weather.
Michelle

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Postby mnp13 » May 31st, 2006, 10:58 am

Riggs' birthday training; in a swampy, stinky, misquito infested section of the park at 7 in the morning. It is a great place to pull because there are trees evenly spaced along the road and the grass is well groomed because there are baseball fields in the middle. We pull for 10 trees and then turn around and go back. This was the first time I pulled there and I think we are going to continue training there. There is even a place for me to tie Ruby out so she can watch and make fun of him while he works and she rolls in the grass.

sorry about the blurry pictures, it's not easy to run backwards and take pictures. The camera has a lot of trouble focusing.

Image

Image

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Image

between pulls. I know that letting him lie down in the harness is bad precident, but I'm not sure how else to let him actually rest between sets. It's way to hot in the car to put him in his crate.
Image

Image

Is this what you wanted to see? I'd love to have a critique of his form. I may be able to convince someone to meet me there at 7 to video him, but I kinda doubt it.
Michelle

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Postby mnp13 » June 1st, 2006, 12:56 pm

No video today. However, I did get "spoken to" by a couple who were getting out of their car to go walking. We were all done and Riggs was laying on the ground panting, still in the harness while I unhooked the tire and put it in my car. It started with "what are you training for?" and when I told them about weight pull the guy told me "that doesn't sound fun for the dog, look how tired he is." so then she says "isn't it mean to make them pull in this heat?" (It was 72, with lower humidity than yesterday.) I just smiled and said that we have to get our training in before it gets any hotter. They gave me a "look" and walked away. the guy made a sarcastic remark to the effect of "I hope your dog doesn't get hurt" but I was trying to ignore them and didn't fully catch it.

Oh yes, I beat him into pulling. Can't you see the whip marks? :rolleyes2:
Michelle

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Postby Romanwild » June 1st, 2006, 1:12 pm

I would have tasered the mofo's. :grind:
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Postby mnp13 » June 1st, 2006, 1:16 pm

Romanwild wrote:I would have tasered the mofo's. :grind:


lol

I just smiled and tried to stay polite. Of course, Ruby was still tied up across the road where we had been pulling so I wanted to finish the conversation before she started barking at them.

They seemed to be both concerned and nosey at the same time.
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Postby cheekymunkee » June 1st, 2006, 1:21 pm

Romanwild wrote:I would have tasered the mofo's. :grind:


:clap: We think way too much alike sometimes Charles! :D
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Postby grizzly » June 1st, 2006, 11:08 pm

when ever somebody says" won't your get get hurt? won't he hurt himself?"
i tell them dogs are smarter than humans-they stop before they hurt themselves- and its true ,all dogs will sit down, bark,jump,or anything but pull before they would hurt themselves.
fact is there are fewer injuries in weight pulling than any other sport
in 5yrs of every wknd of competing all up and down the east coast and out half way across the country westward i have never seen or heard of an injury while pulling.
that usally shuts them up quick
then i smile!!!!!!
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