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by **BritneyP** » July 3rd, 2008, 4:58 pm

My knowledge of the "Blue" gene is really null and void, but I can tell you that this puppy was the product of two fawn/black mask dogs, Duke, PSA1, NVBK Cert. and Dixie, Sch3. Duke is an A'Tim son and Dixie is an Oscar von Lowenfels grand-daughter, if that helps in your pedigree research. None of the other puppies were blue, and from what the breeder has said, I don't believe his lines have produced any other blue dogs either. Some of the puppies in the litter were actually very bright orange like their dad. :mrgreen:

I also forgot to add that, this is what you do after a hard day's training:

by **katiek0417** » July 3rd, 2008, 9:59 pm

BritneyP wrote:My knowledge of the "Blue" gene is really null and void, but I can tell you that this puppy was the product of two fawn/black mask dogs, Duke, PSA1, NVBK Cert. and Dixie, Sch3. Duke is an A'Tim son and Dixie is an Oscar von Lowenfels grand-daughter, if that helps in your pedigree research. None of the other puppies were blue, and from what the breeder has said, I don't believe his lines have produced any other blue dogs either. Some of the puppies in the litter were actually very bright orange like their dad.

I also forgot to add that, this is what you do after a hard day's training:

I'm vaguely familiar with the von Lowenfels lines. Oscar was actually the sire to Jerry's dog Ben v. Lowenfels, who is featured on the Tarheel Canine website as the dog jumping with the dumbell in it's mouth. In addition, he is the dog for which the High in Trial award in PSA is named. These lines go back to the old deux Pottois lines, and includes big names like G'Vitou des deux Pottois...

by **pocketpit** » July 4th, 2008, 1:28 am

Interestingly, enough, for the black gene to come in, there needs to be groenendael mixed in.

I have heard that before but had not read that link so thank you. With Mals naturally often having black masks and overlay I was thinking more in terms of a dilution of that coloring. I however have a limited understanding of coat color genetics. Is that possible or would the dilution factor have to involve the entire coloration of the dog? I'm sure blue Mals are nothing new I just find it interesting that they are becoming more prevalent and wonder why. Thank you for the pedigree databases as well, those should be fun to play with.

by **katiek0417** » July 4th, 2008, 10:29 am

pocketpit wrote:
Interestingly, enough, for the black gene to come in, there needs to be groenendael mixed in.

I have heard that before but had not read that link so thank you. With Mals naturally often having black masks and overlay I was thinking more in terms of a dilution of that coloring. I however have a limited understanding of coat color genetics. Is that possible or would the dilution factor have to involve the entire coloration of the dog? I'm sure blue Mals are nothing new I just find it interesting that they are becoming more prevalent and wonder why. Thank you for the pedigree databases as well, those should be fun to play with.

I'm not sure what you're asking...but the blue is a tint...have you ever seen an old woman who gets her hair done then it has a purple tint to it? Same type of idea here....So, you usually see Groenendael at some point in their lines...but it may not have been real recent

Another example of where Groenendael can influence the lines: black malinois. There really is no such thing as a black malinois (not a true breed, per se)...you get it by breeding a malinois to a groenendael. This should be more recent...And you may not get a whole litter of black malinois, but half and half...

As I said before, I know that the breeding between Ricardo and Winnie produced several "blue" mals. Ricardo, though he looked like a mal, was a mal "mix" and Winnie, though she looked like a Dutchie, was a mix. However, their breedings produced: blue mals, regular looking mals, and dutchies...

I love those databases...I could spend all day on them...

by **ellie@ny** » July 5th, 2008, 8:21 pm

Awesome pictures,lots of fun,fun,fun!!!

by **TheRedQueen** » July 7th, 2008, 12:29 am

Great pics...I love seeing happy, happy dogs! :heartbeat:

I'm also loving the color discussion...I didn't realize that mals "came" in blue...though I guess, color crops up strangely in many breeds. I've seen blue GSD photos too.

I find the color stuff interesting...but I'm not good at the science behind it. lol

Katrina...there was a black "malinois" running flyball around here, before the owner moved away. Dog's name was Dart, short for D'artagnon. He was strking, but I always wondered how that happened...thanks for clarifying!

by **katiek0417** » July 7th, 2008, 4:52 am

TheRedQueen wrote:Great pics...I love seeing happy, happy dogs!

I'm also loving the color discussion...I didn't realize that mals "came" in blue...though I guess, color crops up strangely in many breeds. I've seen blue GSD photos too. I find the color stuff interesting...but I'm not good at the science behind it.

Katrina...there was a black "malinois" running flyball around here, before the owner moved away. Dog's name was Dart, short for D'artagnon. He was strking, but I always wondered how that happened...thanks for clarifying!

I LOVE black mals, but they have quite the reputation...the reputation of being severely handler aggressive!

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