.---attention is attention to dogs, (and even children, ). They don't necessarily care if it's positive or negative.
dogcrazyjen wrote:Well, if my way works for Tess, how am I wrong?
Attention is attention IF the subjects world is all roses and candy canes. But if the attention is getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn, or catching a smack in the fanny for telling their mother or father to go "eff" themselves. That attention then becomes a correction and is no longer just attention.
Cuda wrote:.---attention is attention to dogs, (and even children, ). They don't necessarily care if it's positive or negative.
Attention is attention IF the subjects world is all roses and candy canes. But if the attention is getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn, or catching a smack in the fanny for telling their mother or father to go "eff" themselves. That attention then becomes a correction and is no longer just attention.
negative attention and positive attention are the same per say. in other words, negative attention gets you to pay attention to the dog , positive attention gets you to pay attention to the dog.. its just one is good, and one is oh poop i am in trouble.. but at least he is paying attention to me, so i will take the punishment, cause he is acknowledging me...
there is a difference between eating and stealing food from a pack member to not pooping outside and regressing in training... its not the same..
a-bull wrote:dogcrazyjen wrote:Well, if my way works for Tess, how am I wrong?
Just because something works, doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea---and I didn't say you're "wrong"---I just do not think this 'matchstick training method' is a good method to be offering people.
Has anyone run this matchstick idea by their vet??
a-bull wrote:Cuda wrote:.---attention is attention to dogs, (and even children, ). They don't necessarily care if it's positive or negative.
Attention is attention IF the subjects world is all roses and candy canes. But if the attention is getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn, or catching a smack in the fanny for telling their mother or father to go "eff" themselves. That attention then becomes a correction and is no longer just attention.
"Getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn" is an example of packorder---not attention seeking. Dogs don't eat out of turn for attention.
A child "telling their mother or father to go 'eff' themselves" is an example of rebellion, anger, frustration, etc.---not attention seeking.
katiek0417 wrote:a-bull wrote:dogcrazyjen wrote:Well, if my way works for Tess, how am I wrong?
Just because something works, doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea---and I didn't say you're "wrong"---I just do not think this 'matchstick training method' is a good method to be offering people.
Has anyone run this matchstick idea by their vet??
Actually, yes. I have run it by several vets. My vet thought it was a good idea.
And guess what, a-bull...the second dog I have used it on NEVER pooped in the house (Unless she had a wicked case of diarrhea) - and I got her at 6.5 weeks old - she's nearly 10 mos now. My older dog will only potty in the house when she's ready to go into heat (and I excuse that b/c she's usually a flake around that time). The most important part was not that they pooped...but that they did it outside. I ensured that there wasn't failure...that EVERY time they pooped, they got praised for it....
My dog consistently go outside: without a match. I can still use it now in a pinch, though. You are automatically disqualified from ANY competition if your dog eliminates on the field. It is often easy to get a dog to pee...harder to get them to poop...the match ensures that they are "empty" before hitting the field.
Cuda wrote:a-bull wrote:Cuda wrote:.---attention is attention to dogs, (and even children, ). They don't necessarily care if it's positive or negative.
Attention is attention IF the subjects world is all roses and candy canes. But if the attention is getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn, or catching a smack in the fanny for telling their mother or father to go "eff" themselves. That attention then becomes a correction and is no longer just attention.
"Getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn" is an example of packorder---not attention seeking. Dogs don't eat out of turn for attention.
A child "telling their mother or father to go 'eff' themselves" is an example of rebellion, anger, frustration, etc.---not attention seeking.
Okay but it is still attention in some way shape or form that they will receive after the fact, is it not?
Cuda wrote:a-bull wrote:Cuda wrote:.---attention is attention to dogs, (and even children, ). They don't necessarily care if it's positive or negative.
Attention is attention IF the subjects world is all roses and candy canes. But if the attention is getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn, or catching a smack in the fanny for telling their mother or father to go "eff" themselves. That attention then becomes a correction and is no longer just attention.
"Getting tackled by the pack leader for trying to eat before its their turn" is an example of packorder---not attention seeking. Dogs don't eat out of turn for attention.
A child "telling their mother or father to go 'eff' themselves" is an example of rebellion, anger, frustration, etc.---not attention seeking.
Okay but it is still attention in some way shape or form that they will receive after the fact, is it not?
The dog is much less prone to "take the punishment" if that punishment is enough to impress into the dogs head that acting a fool while in the crate is not a good idea.
dogcrazyjen wrote:
What we did worked. It worked well, and it did not take hours, and no one was hurt. I wanted her to know I was disciplining her for whining. Wild dogs do not wait until another dog behaves and then rewards, they correct bad behavior. And that dog knows who is doing the correcting. There is nothing wrong, cruel, or unnatural about correction, as long as it is done well, and for the right reasons.
You just told it that if you jump on me, you'll get me to touch you...even if it is to push you off/yell at you/whatever....so, instead: praise it for sitting quietly waiting to be pet...and IGNORE it when it jumps up....
a-bull wrote:right, and for the people who are having trouble with their dogs whining and barking in their crate, I thought that was a good little blurb about why that may be---because I agree, if the crate is properly introduced, you shouldn't have a dog that barks or whines incessantly when crated.
I never said there was anything "wrong, cruel, or unnatural" about correction---
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