Breaking up Dog Fights

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Postby iluvk9 » October 28th, 2009, 6:52 pm

Wow. I need to comment about your video. First, let me tell you that I am just your average dog owner, with a Pit Bull, Pit/Lab, Golden and XL Lab mix.

1) You are WAY too dramatic in your comments. You do a disservice to Pit Bulls and all dogs. It's like you are setting the audience up for a blood curling fight, involving a Pit Bull.

2) You say something to the effect of, "I am bringing the dogs back to give them the OPPORTUNITY to fight again..that's how you deal with dog fighting."

Uhhhh....NOT.

3) Jackie was bored shitless being in your backyard before you got home. I think I saw her chewing or licking herself out of boredom. She would have been better in a crate with a stuffed kong.

4) You are fortunate you were able to grab the "attacking dog" and swing him off. My Golden would have taken your face off.

Sorry, but that video really turned me off.
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Postby Ino » October 28th, 2009, 7:40 pm

On top of the video that everyone already commented on, I can not believe he has another video bashing spay neuter- calling it irresponsible, then saying do not let dogs fall into the hands of shelters. Does he think people not fixing their dogs doesn't contribute to the shelter population? My neutered male dog will not contribute to the growing population of unwanted dogs- if he was not neutered, there would be that possibility. I am not talking about responsible breeders, I just find both videos I watched of his irresponsible. Also, too many of his videos say "Pitbull VS wild dog" :mad2: I think he is only posting his link and using those type of titles to increase his youtube views.
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Postby BigDogBuford » October 28th, 2009, 7:59 pm

I think I smell a troll....

:trollDance:
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Postby call2arms » October 28th, 2009, 9:11 pm

Stealing the words out of my mouth, Jeanine.

Post, re-post, let it simmer, come back, stir the pot, start another post.
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Postby DemoDick » October 28th, 2009, 9:14 pm

BigDogBuford wrote:I think I smell a troll....

:trollDance:


I disagree. A troll knowingly adopts a persona in order to stir people up. This guy appears to sincerely believe his line, as he has put a lot of work into promoting himself.

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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 9:18 pm

Hello People,

I'd like to thank everyone who watched the video!!

I've had swine flu for a few days and had it when I was creating that which is may have something to do with the way it came out :D

No, actually, I'm quite proud of it. It amused me and amusement is important in this world of increasingly no fun.

Here's the thing about 97% of "dog experts." They are stone cold stiff and boring. I was watching a chew toy video review by this "Adam Katz" guy the other day and he rambles on like a drone for minutes talking about chew toys and shows a dog for about 20 seconds in the video.

And then I look at my recent chew toy videos. Now this is how to do a chew toy review video!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM43bFokWKQ


But in that video, besides the chew toy being ripped apart eventually, is the relationship now, 5-6 months later between Jackie and Kwame. And it's great. Yes, there have been a couple more tifs, but by NOT AVOIDING THE ISSUE, it helps me find out what the issue is. It helps me crystalize the causes of aggression. By not being afraid of dog fights, I can let them happen and figure out why and then know what to worry about and what not to worry about and not have to walk around on egg shells all the time.... I know you all think (well, he doesn't know anything about pitbulls) I know dogs. and pitbulls are dogs.

Kwame Brown is a great, great dog. But he's a dog. A dog is essentially a wild animal that lives in our houses. That's what most people who have problems with dogs fail to understand as a baseline idea.

Some of you may look at that dog and think there's something wrong with him. I don't. I simply figure out how to adapt that wild animal into living into a human household. That's really what dog training is. Some are more wild than others and he definitely is. No problem. He's also an AWESOME watchdog.

But he's not randomly vicious. There are certain things and situations that set him off, and this video helped crystalize one thing for me. He hates to see another dog being rewarded for training. He loves to learn things and be trained himself and when he sees another dog being trained, especially with a rawhide stick (which is what I was using in that video) he goes berserk and attacks. The other thing is of course meat.

Well, you might think Okay, let's avoid training Jackie Brown in front of Kwame Brown. Let's keep them separated! Let's not let them in the yard together!

Of Course Not!
You do exactly that thing that makes him go berserk and you get it under control, but you develop a plan first and and you acclimatize him slowly to the idea that the world doesn't revolve totally around him at all times.

But that's not important right now.

What's important is this. I knew that the reaction to my video would be primarily negative, (only read a few so far) and I also figured there would be a few people who secretly loved it but would be afraid to say so.

Whether that's accurate or not, I don't know, but I'll read the replies in a minute. Just wanted to thank you for watching, but let me say this.

As stated that wasn't a "how to" video for you all to follow and emulate. It's a video from someone who has a lot of experience breaking up dog fights between 70-100 lb dogs, and who has learned how to do it without getting himself or the dogs injured.

Take it for what it's worth.

Have a great night

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Postby mnp13 » October 28th, 2009, 9:43 pm

dogtvcom wrote:A dog is essentially a wild animal that lives in our houses.

Well, no. Dogs have been domesticated for over four thousand years. That has been documented in everything from cave paintings to hieroglyphics to the Bible.

dogtvcom wrote:What's important is this. I knew that the reaction to my video would be primarily negative, (only read a few so far) and I also figured there would be a few people who secretly loved it but would be afraid to say so.

Well, no. If anyone here loved your video they would say that they loved your video. That's how things here work. However, you happen to be on a board full of educated dog owners, and all of us watched you set up your puppy to get attacked by your other dog on purpose. I am 100% sure you are the very first person that I have ever heard say that they think that setting up their dogs to attack each other is ethical, responsible training.

dogtvcom wrote:It's a video from someone who has a lot of experience breaking up dog fights between 70-100 lb dogs, and who has learned how to do it without getting himself or the dogs injured.

Once again, there was not a dog fight on that video. I have watched it twice - and neither time had a dog fight in it. There was a snarky attack, but that is FAR from a dog fight. If that is what you term a "dog fight" then you need a little more experience with dogs. Stuff like that generally breaks up by yelling at my house. :|
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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 10:12 pm

Oh, I'm sure that would have stopped with a yell!

It wasn't a fight because I was fast enough to make sure it wasn't.

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Postby call2arms » October 28th, 2009, 10:14 pm

You're saying this to people who own real pit bulls with actual high drive. :|
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Postby DemoDick » October 28th, 2009, 10:17 pm

dogtvcom wrote:Oh, I'm sure that would have stopped with a yell!

It wasn't a fight because I was fast enough to make sure it wasn't.

mp


It wasn't a "fight" because you have dogs who don't want to. Your stumbling into the situation with various sporting equipment is nothing to emulate.

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Postby LMM » October 28th, 2009, 10:20 pm

What's important is this. I knew that the reaction to my video would be primarily negative, (only read a few so far) and I also figured there would be a few people who secretly loved it but would be afraid to say so.


Watched it. Didn't like it. NO ONE on this forum is afraid to say jackshyt.

This is highly irresponsible behavior of a pit bull owner.
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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 10:23 pm

mnp13 wrote:Ok, I watched the video...

First of all, that was far from a fight. Like light years from a fight. That was a snarky, bratty dog bullying a puppy. You grabbed the bully, separated them, then brought him back outside a minute later.

Snarky crap like that happens all the time at my house, it ends on its own most of the time if we tell them to knock it off. In August, when Ruby had stolen a bag of treats fair and square and Inara decided to share in the booty. It actually sounded a lot like that, and I got upstairs, picked Ruby up off of her and that was the end of it. We all hung out in the living room for the rest of the day, (no basketball needed.)

I have no idea what your point was with the basketball. You didn't return to what you were doing previously, training Jackie, you just let them back out in yard and bounced the basketball around.

REAL dog fights don't just end because you pick one dog up. If Jackie had really been into that fight, 2:29 would have been footage of her latching on to the other dog's stomach and there would have been NOTHING you could have done to stop her from doing it.



So if you think this was nothing, why are you criticizing me for allow it to happen if it happens all the time in your house?

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Postby LMM » October 28th, 2009, 10:25 pm

And furthermore, watching that video and hearing that poor young set up dog yelp like that makes me want to kick you in the head.
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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 10:27 pm

DemoDick wrote:
dogtvcom wrote:Oh, I'm sure that would have stopped with a yell!

It wasn't a fight because I was fast enough to make sure it wasn't.

mp


It wasn't a "fight" because you have dogs who don't want to. Your stumbling into the situation with various sporting equipment is nothing to emulate.

Demo Dick



In other words, only people with "real" pitbulls they can't control understand "real" dog aggression. People like you?

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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 10:31 pm

LMM wrote:And furthermore, watching that video and hearing that poor young set up dog yelp like that makes me want to kick you in the head.


Did not set her up. :nono:

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Postby Michael » October 28th, 2009, 10:37 pm

iluvk9 wrote:Wow. I need to comment about your video. First, let me tell you that I am just your average dog owner, with a Pit Bull, Pit/Lab, Golden and XL Lab mix.

1) You are WAY too dramatic in your comments. You do a disservice to Pit Bulls and all dogs. It's like you are setting the audience up for a blood curling fight, involving a Pit Bull.

2) You say something to the effect of, "I am bringing the dogs back to give them the OPPORTUNITY to fight again..that's how you deal with dog fighting."

Uhhhh....NOT.

3) Jackie was bored shitless being in your backyard before you got home. I think I saw her chewing or licking herself out of boredom. She would have been better in a crate with a stuffed kong.

4) You are fortunate you were able to grab the "attacking dog" and swing him off. My Golden would have taken your face off.

Sorry, but that video really turned me off.


No worries, but since nobody else on the internet is making videos on how to break up dog fights I guess we are stuck with mine!

mp
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Postby DemoDick » October 28th, 2009, 10:39 pm

dogtvcom wrote:
In other words, only people with "real" pitbulls they can't control understand "real" dog aggression. People like you?

mp


The control I have on my dog is excellent. It's a level of performance that you should aspire to. I can give you training advice when you need it. All you have to do is ask.

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Postby mnp13 » October 28th, 2009, 10:46 pm

dogtvcom wrote:So if you think this was nothing, why are you criticizing me for allow it to happen if it happens all the time in your house?

Because I don't set my dogs up for it. HUGE difference. Stupid, snarky crap like that happens over toys, spots on Ruby's chair, who is closer to me when I'm eating popcorn... whatever. However, they don't happen because I do something specifically designed to cause an issue. You see, in my house, I don't have a scared puppy and a bully adult dog, I have three adult Pit Bulls - who if I set up to have a fight would likely end up with thousands of dollars in vet bills if not a dead dog.

dogtvcom wrote:In other words, only people with "real" pitbulls they can't control understand "real" dog aggression.

Can't control? What are you talking about? My male competes in obedience trials, he has been off leash in the ring with a dozen other dogs, in a building full of people and dogs. We also take group classes and do off leash work in the building with literally dozens of other dogs.

He's also the dog on the left in the video seen here:
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=23382
Please take a few minutes and watch that video, you will see a dog that actually wants to fight; not get rude and snarky - which is all your red dog was being in your video. Read the discussion in that thread and you'll learn a good deal about aggression. A lot of us here have seen and lived with the real deal. If your video is an example of what you think is "real aggression" then you need to spend some time learning about the differences between aggression and bullying.

One other note: you say in your video that there is no other footage on the internet but yours that shows how to break up a dog fight. Well, first of all, yours doesn't. Second of all, to actually show breaking up a real dog fight, you'd have to stage a real dog fight.
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Postby call2arms » October 28th, 2009, 11:10 pm

It's time for a reality check, in case you want to see what a real dog fight looks like.
*graphic*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q46d_xw_vOY&feature=related

Try breaking that up with a basketball.

* I only put it here for the graphic images *
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Postby TheRedQueen » October 28th, 2009, 11:55 pm

Here's the thing about 97% of "dog experts." They are stone cold stiff and boring.


What dog experts are you watching? (other than your one example that is...) I have been to many seminars, and attended Clicker Expo last year...and saw many big-name trainers...and have been not only educated, but highly entertained. (and by entertainment, I don't mean repeatedly bashing Cesar Millan).
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