Putting down a "DA" dog?

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Postby BullyLady » September 8th, 2009, 10:46 pm

Okay, so this is ALL hypothetical, but I did get a little up in arms about it and wanted some other people's input.

So, I'm chatting with a friend of mine today who has a lab that's the same age as Shelby, almost two. I dog-sat this lab for three weeks last month, she's a GREAT dog! She totally has that lab "will to please" and would keel over and die if you asked it of her. My friend has done a so-so job of training her, he uses pretty rudimentary techniques, believes in rubbing their faces in their potty accidents and such, but she is well behaved in spite of it. This is his first dog, they have had no major issues whatsoever. Or minor ones that I know of, come to think of it.

So anyways, he says to me, "Well, now I know that she's good with small dogs." I asked him what happened, and he proceeds to tell me how he had been playing with her off leash at a park, and she spotted a little pug and went running for it. The pug was also off leash. Now that in and of itself doesn't sit well with me, I'm not okay with offleash, but then he says, "Good thing, too. If she had shown any signs of bad behavior I would have had to put her down. Can't have an aggressive dog around." :o I told him I didn't wish to pursue this conversation track and we let it go at that.

Okay, here's where I want other people's input. To me, if he put a dog down for chasing and possibly catching and injuring a small dog that's punishing the dog for his mistake of 1) allowing the dog off leash with strange dogs around and 2) allowing the dog off leash without appropriate obedience, namely a solid recall.

Agree? Not?
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Postby call2arms » September 8th, 2009, 10:52 pm

Agreed.

I mean, for me I think there's a bit of pit bull owner "mentality" where being DA isn't the end of the world, just deal with it, but it is a big deal to some people... In any case pit bull or lab, if you do love your dog and it wants to eat others, keep it on leash and suck it up, but that's just me. Euthanising is just a TAD strong as a reaction, IMO. :shock:
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Postby BigDogBuford » September 8th, 2009, 11:09 pm

A lot of people who don't have Pit Bulls or other breeds that DA is common in equate DA with HA. They simply just don't know the difference. :|
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Postby TheRedQueen » September 8th, 2009, 11:30 pm

I can see where he is coming from, though that's VERY extreme, imho. :| I would personally have trouble having a DA dog in my house as I have a LOT of extra dogs coming through the doors here, and it's nice to have non-DA dogs. Inara is HA, and I find that easier to deal with. All in what we're able to put up with.
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Postby Malli » September 9th, 2009, 3:32 am

yeah a LOT of people think dog and human aggression are the same.

My question : how does your friend NOT know how his dog will react? Has she been aggressive before but is inconsistent? Or has he just not really socialized her?

Either way, its kind of a hands off approach.

Definitely seems like an overreaction.
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Postby LMM » September 9th, 2009, 9:19 am

Agreed.

I have dealt with and am currently dealing with DA dogs. It's a manageable situation and I've never thought DA was a euthanizable offense. It is to be managed by the OWNER. I don't blame you for not discussing it further with him. It definitely seems like a very hands off approach with all future consequences falling on the dog :(
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Postby cheekymunkee » September 9th, 2009, 7:47 pm

There are people who do own ( and a few who rescue) pit bulls but will still put down a DA dog. Rescue I can understand although I dont agree with it. Ollie, my pom/spitz mix, is DA, not to the point that Munkee is (thank gawd) but she will try to whip another dog's ass in a heart beat if I let her near them.....so, like Munkee, she isnt allowed near them. It isnt that hard & she could care less if she has doggie friends or not. I wouldnt even THINK about putting a dog down for being DA. I would also have a hard time putting an HA dog down unless there was no way I could control it's environment or it was HA to family members that is lives with. It is not hard to control a dog's environment......I do it every day.
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Postby LMM » September 9th, 2009, 9:23 pm

cheekymunkee wrote:There are people who do own ( and a few who rescue) pit bulls but will still put down a DA dog. Rescue I can understand although I dont agree with it. Ollie, my pom/spitz mix, is DA, not to the point that Munkee is (thank gawd) but she will try to whip another dog's ass in a heart beat if I let her near them.....so, like Munkee, she isnt allowed near them. It isnt that hard & she could care less if she has doggie friends or not. I wouldnt even THINK about putting a dog down for being DA. I would also have a hard time putting an HA dog down unless there was no way I could control it's environment or it was HA to family members that is lives with. It is not hard to control a dog's environment......I do it every day.



It's funny you say that, I have to keep reminding my mom that Molly doesn't give a rats azz if she has a play buddy or not :rolleyes2: In fact, since implementing strict crate/rotate at her house, Molly is prancing around with that famous bully grin. We have never seen it before now.
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Postby furever_pit » September 9th, 2009, 9:51 pm

Unfortunately it is true that a lot of people think a dog being DA means it is HA by default. I find that many people don't even know there is more than one type of aggression or that it is not inherently a broad spectrum issue.

Personally, I have absolutely no issue with DA dogs and definitely don't see it as a reason to put a dog down. It is a manageable situation and in a weird way I actually enjoy the challenge. As for HA, for me it depends on the dog and whether or not it is something that is manageable. I don't even mind a dog that is a tad on the handler aggressive side cause I like my dogs with balls, please and thank you.
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Postby Klopfer » September 11th, 2009, 2:51 pm

He really thinks of putting his dog to sleep because he's dog aggressive?! Sorry, there's no reason for putting a dog to sleep besides a medical reason!
I couldn't do that to my dog (and blessidly it's forbidden in germany without a medical reason), he's a family member, he's a friend.
If someone really decides to put a dog to sleep because he's dog aggressive, he better should own a toy dog than a live animal.

There are other ways to live the life with a dog aggressive dog: not going to off leash parks (I hate them), muzzel, education ( :rolleyes2: ).
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Postby call2arms » September 11th, 2009, 3:38 pm

The more I read the more I think it's a "dog knowedge" thing... I know I would not tolerate a hint of HA, while someone else said they liked a bit of handler aggression - because they can handle it well, and I know I would not. I guess those people who may put down a DA dog lack the experience and knowledge to deal with it, my problem is only the lack of reaching out for that knowledge/learning in order to deal with things.
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Postby juniper8204 » September 11th, 2009, 8:15 pm

Klopfer wrote:
If someone really decides to put a dog to sleep because he's dog aggressive, he better should own a toy dog than a live animal.


At first when I read that, I thought you meant toy breeds. :doh: On that subject, toy breeds are some of the worst for DA. My grandmother's Yorkie is a TERROR when it comes to other dogs. And my grandmother thinks it's the funniest thing. This dog weighs 4lbs. max, and he used to chase my 120lb. Great Dane all the time, and my Dane was genuinely afraid of him! When my big guy would get tired and stand panting unable to run anymore, that bastard Yorkie would jump up and try to latch on to his tongue and bite his feet.

And I do think that before you get a dog, you should realize that they are first and foremost ANIMALS with different instincts than our own and different displays of territory and agitation than our own. Some dogs are just fine around other dogs and there are others that you have to watch every second and should never be around other dogs and no matter how much training, that instinct will always be there.

Before I had my pits, I didn't understand DA, and thought all DA dogs were vicious and would turn on people :rolleyes2: but now that I've had every kind of dog personality come through my doors I realize that it's just one of those things and you do what you have to do to have a peaceful household but still have happy (and alive) dogs.

Oona is DA...she stays by herself...when the three that get along are inside, she's out, and vice versa. I personally don't see the point in euthanizing an otherwise healthy dog. :|
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Postby Klopfer » September 12th, 2009, 5:18 am

juniper8204 wrote:
Klopfer wrote:
If someone really decides to put a dog to sleep because he's dog aggressive, he better should own a toy dog than a live animal.


At first when I read that, I thought you meant toy breeds. :doh: On that subject, toy breeds are some of the worst for DA.

I'm sorry, I meant a plush toy for children ;)
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Postby call2arms » September 12th, 2009, 7:20 pm

The absolute worst DA dog I've seen was a Scottie. He tried to EAT everything in sight, would bare his teeth and lunge with mouth open to any dog even daring to look at him. His idiot owner just kept telling to stop... Talk about the other opposite of the spectrum!!
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