Decision 2008

Everything that doesn't fit anywhere else!

Postby BullyLady » November 9th, 2008, 3:05 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:Alrighty. I wasn't sure if it was coming from our taxes. The whole federal deficit thing just really confuses the bejeezus out of me. I think the Federal Reserve should just make more money. Or the mint. Or whoever makes it.


That is how inflation happens, it undermines the value of the money. I think it was Argentina where people were literally using their currency as TP, beause they couldn't afford to buy real TP and a loaf of bread was like 200 of their currency unit.... Printing more money will just make things more expensive, meanwhile you and I won't be getting raises to keep up with that kind of inflation.

That is why the deficit is so dangerous, it's generally the same idea. That as our deficit gets larger we have basically "made" more money, and next thing you know milk is over $4 a gallon. :|
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Postby Violet » November 9th, 2008, 3:19 pm

cheekymunkee wrote:Economics IS very confusing but the bottom line is......if it needs to be paid for the american worker is the one footing the bill.


exactly..it might be good short term. I dont know too many people who wouldnt find it useful. Sadly, it wotn work as hoped for a LOT of people. Those in serious need will end up applying the stimulus towards bills. Which does NOT help the economy. It only helps when people go shopping. And then it is very short lived unless there is some miracle cure for our slumping economic condition.

Living in the great state of Washington i don't have a great deal of faith in Democrats ability to help the economy. Our blessed Governor just taxes the crap out of us. Fortunately..now she will be considering state income taxes as well. (I know..alot of you already pay them) That should help :neutral: Maybe raise those gas taxes just a LEETLE bit higher..why SHOULDNT we have the highest gas taxes in the US?
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Postby BullyLady » November 9th, 2008, 3:24 pm

Violet wrote:
cheekymunkee wrote:Economics IS very confusing but the bottom line is......if it needs to be paid for the american worker is the one footing the bill.


exactly..it might be good short term. I dont know too many people who wouldnt find it useful. Sadly, it wotn work as hoped for a LOT of people. Those in serious need will end up applying the stimulus towards bills. Which does NOT help the economy. It only helps when people go shopping. And then it is very short lived unless there is some miracle cure for our slumping economic condition.

Living in the great state of Washington i don't have a great deal of faith in Democrats ability to help the economy. Our blessed Governor just taxes the crap out of us. Fortunately..now she will be considering state income taxes as well. (I know..alot of you already pay them) That should help :neutral: Maybe raise those gas taxes just a LEETLE bit higher..why SHOULDNT we have the highest gas taxes in the US?


I live in Washington as well. I have to say, I'm not too worried about the state income tax thing. Possibly that is because I came here from NYC, where I paid Federal, State, and City taxes..... lol I didn't mind it there and I will be okay with it here, too.
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Postby SassyCassie » November 9th, 2008, 3:42 pm

My favorite bit of news this week?

The treasurery department needs to borrow $550 billion to fund the $700 billion bailout.

Nice.
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Postby Violet » November 9th, 2008, 3:43 pm

Like I said..I know many people already pay it. And im not sure its neccessarily a BAD thing except for the timing.
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Postby pitbullmamaliz » November 9th, 2008, 5:15 pm

I thought everybody had to pay federal, state and local taxes! :oops:
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Postby Violet » November 9th, 2008, 5:24 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:I thought everybody had to pay federal, state and local taxes! :oops:


we pay our taxes locally in different ways. As does every state. We don't pay state income taxes but..our sales tax is 9%(3rd highest in the nation), we have a tax called a *sin*tax on items like cigarrettes and alcohol(again, the 3rd highest in the nation). Then our gas taxes, as listed previously, are some of the highest in the nation. So..it really is a trade off. No matter WHERE you live the government gets you.

The only way I could see imposing a state income tax is if some of our other taxes are reduced. :|
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Postby mnp13 » November 9th, 2008, 6:39 pm

Violet wrote:we pay our taxes locally in different ways. As does every state. We don't pay state income taxes but..our sales tax is 9%(3rd highest in the nation), we have a tax called a *sin*tax on items like cigarrettes and alcohol(again, the 3rd highest in the nation). Then our gas taxes, as listed previously, are some of the highest in the nation. So..it really is a trade off. No matter WHERE you live the government gets you.


All of the above applies to New York as well. Sales tax varies by county here, but in Monroe county it's just over 5%
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Postby cheekymunkee » November 9th, 2008, 7:12 pm

pitbullmamaliz wrote:I thought everybody had to pay federal, state and local taxes! :oops:


Nope, not in Texas. Federal only. That is why we have the lottery.
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Postby cheekymunkee » November 9th, 2008, 7:14 pm

We do pay state & city taxes on purchases ( except food & drugs) but everything else is taxed to hell & back. They raised cigarette taxes by $1 a pack a couple years ago.
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Postby Violet » November 9th, 2008, 7:20 pm

cheekymunkee wrote:We do pay state & city taxes on purchases ( except food & drugs) but everything else is taxed to hell & back. They raised cigarette taxes by $1 a pack a couple years ago.


They tax the heck out of our utilities in Tacoma. I guess they figure thats one of those things you MUST pay..so boy do you ever pay.
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Postby cheekymunkee » November 10th, 2008, 1:52 am

They are donating part of the sale to a great cause. :|

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Postby TheRedQueen » November 10th, 2008, 2:03 am

Violet wrote:Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your take, the large, below and meeting poverty section of our country NEVER pays taxes and, if working, gets a nice big chunk of change at tax time courtesy of EIC. Then there are those lovely child tax credits. Yummy. Free money. So..I don't know how it's ever actually made up aside from taxing the crap out of people who have managed to get ahead in life.


I still want to know where I sign up for this..I didn't pay taxes, but got no money back either...but everyone keeps talking about folks in poverty getting money back. I want some! :neutral:
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Postby cheekymunkee » November 10th, 2008, 2:32 am

What she means by never pay taxes ( i think) is that working people making low wages DO pay taxes throughout the year. But, with EIC and tax credits they get it ALL back at the end of the year. Plus some. It is possible to get back more than you paid in so they are really paying no taxes.
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Postby Violet » November 10th, 2008, 2:52 am

Exactly what Debby said. If you fall under the guidlines for EIC then you not only don't pay federal taxes, you get back money you didn't pay. Then there are child tax credits, school credits, etc. etc.
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Postby DemoDick » November 10th, 2008, 4:02 am

Just a couple things to ponder. Income taxes are not "collected", they are forcibly taken. When you hear people saying that the Fed "collected" X amount of dollars last year from private individuals, what really happened was those people were told to pay up or go to jail. Also, Federal income taxes were NEVER intended to be a long term strategy, but once Government starts hitting the pipe it can't put it down.

The questions we should be asking are as follows:

(1) Do our various levels of government really need the taxes they collect or could they do without?
(2) Where exactly is that money going and how much control do citizens really have over it?
(3) Could private industry do a better job based on a profit motive and free market competition?

As a general rule, if you want to get something done incorrectly, late, and overbudget, you turn it in to a Government project. If you want to get that same project done on time, affordably, and competently, you hire someone who knows what they are doing and give them an incentive bonus for exemplary performance.

It isn't rocket science.

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Postby mnp13 » November 10th, 2008, 10:56 am

mnp13 wrote:All of the above applies to New York as well. Sales tax varies by county here, but in Monroe county it's just over 5%


oops, that's 8%. We hvae state tax plus county tax to get our total tax. In Oneida county, where my parents live it's 9%
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Postby airwalk » November 10th, 2008, 11:55 am

DemoDick wrote:Just a couple things to ponder. Income taxes are not "collected", they are forcibly taken. When you hear people saying that the Fed "collected" X amount of dollars last year from private individuals, what really happened was those people were told to pay up or go to jail. Also, Federal income taxes were NEVER intended to be a long term strategy, but once Government starts hitting the pipe it can't put it down.

The questions we should be asking are as follows:

(1) Do our various levels of government really need the taxes they collect or could they do without?
(2) Where exactly is that money going and how much control do citizens really have over it?
(3) Could private industry do a better job based on a profit motive and free market competition?

As a general rule, if you want to get something done incorrectly, late, and overbudget, you turn it in to a Government project. If you want to get that same project done on time, affordably, and competently, you hire someone who knows what they are doing and give them an incentive bonus for exemplary performance.

It isn't rocket science.

Demo Dick


Demo, in general I agree with you. Many things done by Government could be done more efficiently by a for profit organization; the big HOWEVER though is that many things government does, it does because for profit organizations don't want it because there is little or no profit to be made.

I know it's tempting to assume that Government could simply get leaner and therefore save money. The challenge with that assumption is that it is not true across the board. I, for one government agency, watch every penny we spend and there is no profit to be made in disposable dogs. We just showed it by going out for a proposal that failed miserably. No one wants my throwaway dogs. One proposal was willing if they could also do all the licensing and citations and govern the cost of fines and be on a fee for service basis.

This means that those with money get service, those without do not...and frankly its been my experience that those without money are the ones we end up servicing because they have too many dogs or dogs they can't afford or need temporary food or other assistance.

So you must, as a community, make a choice.
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Postby mnp13 » November 10th, 2008, 12:14 pm

One of the ideas to reduce the size of the government is to get rid of hte IRS. Make it a flat tax and be done with it. The IRS costs billions a year, a flat tax would reduce the tax manual to about 10 pages and the IRS staff to just about no one.

According to some calculations the amount collected would actually go up, and with the savings from getting rid of 90% of the IRS's overhead we would come out WAY ahead in the game.
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Postby cheekymunkee » November 12th, 2008, 10:13 pm

RP!!!!

VOTE for him dammit!
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